Urban Shocker
Doyenne
My local library acts as much as a cultural centre, with talks by authors and social events, as a traditional "bookish" environment. It's just one more place that enriches my experience of the city.
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- Thread starter Irishmonk
- Start date
insertrealname
Active Member
I'm surprised that there has only been a few mentions so far in this thread of the major reason for having smaller library branches, rather than just a handful of major branches: if the public library is going to perform its educational, entertainment, and community functions adequately, it has to be physically close to the people and neighbourhoods it serves.
Put yourselves in the position of a lower income Toronto family for a moment: e.g., you don't have the mobility options of the wealthier segment of the city (1st or 2nd car) to quickly access the major branches, nor, for instance, do you have the time to bring young children to a more distant library branch; you may also need the literacy and vocational services provided by your public library, simply because you don't have the time or money to attend those elsewhere in town.
The immediate locality of neighbourhood libraries in those circumstances does become a very significant part of effective library service investment, implementation and delivery. Just maintaining a few big branches would not be an efficient use of the library budget.
This thread also shows the widening gulf between those who can afford personal access to information (smart phones, broadband internet, etc.) and privately acquired cultural goods (books, CDs, DVDs, etc.), and those who may only be able to afford a basic provision of the same through their local library.
Put yourselves in the position of a lower income Toronto family for a moment: e.g., you don't have the mobility options of the wealthier segment of the city (1st or 2nd car) to quickly access the major branches, nor, for instance, do you have the time to bring young children to a more distant library branch; you may also need the literacy and vocational services provided by your public library, simply because you don't have the time or money to attend those elsewhere in town.
The immediate locality of neighbourhood libraries in those circumstances does become a very significant part of effective library service investment, implementation and delivery. Just maintaining a few big branches would not be an efficient use of the library budget.
This thread also shows the widening gulf between those who can afford personal access to information (smart phones, broadband internet, etc.) and privately acquired cultural goods (books, CDs, DVDs, etc.), and those who may only be able to afford a basic provision of the same through their local library.
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Marko
Active Member
I don't recall anyone stating that the city should go from 99 branches to a 'handful' of major branches - let's not build strawmen here. Most people who are at least open to including libraries in the cost savings are talking about maybe losing a handful of branches and perhaps reduced staffing or hours at others. They're seeking a 5-10% reduction in cost, not 90%. There would still be 90+ branches - still enough to keep Toronto at the top of the list.
tkip
Active Member
I would love to see the annual budget for a single library and see the breakdown between staff salaries, expenses and revenues.
ceaz40
Active Member
Urban Shocker....well said.....I know why I was pleased to meet you a couple of years ago....why I carefully read and respect what you have to say!
Tacoma
Active Member
It's all well and good and so warm and fuzzy... let there be as many library branches as Tim Horton's... but who's going to pay for all this? We're told by the City that we'll be spending more than we take in and now we want to spend even more? Have you guys forgotten about the 2008 recession and greed and debt?
In this zero sum game, where do we take away when we add more branches? I'll say this much... I'm not interested in paying more taxes and taxes on taxes and taxes disguised as something else, so if not consolidating some less used library branches that are in close proximity, then please say where else in the City budget we best cut?... or should we all form a circle and sing kumbaya and pray the money will magically fall from our City trees?
In this zero sum game, where do we take away when we add more branches? I'll say this much... I'm not interested in paying more taxes and taxes on taxes and taxes disguised as something else, so if not consolidating some less used library branches that are in close proximity, then please say where else in the City budget we best cut?... or should we all form a circle and sing kumbaya and pray the money will magically fall from our City trees?
Northern Light
Superstar
There are detailed, branch by branch reports published showing how busy they are by borrowing and visits in both absolute numbers and ranked. I've read it before, it was presented to the board; I'm sure you can ask for a copy.
Northern Light
Superstar
For those looking at cuts to TPL, my problems w/that would be this.
Firstly, its a comparatively cheap service in the scheme of things, just over the 100M mark, in a 9B budget.
Second, its one of the most cost-efficient. To their credit, TPL has been aggressively installing automatic check-outs which reduce the need for staff (under Miller the savings were reinvested in additional open hours); this year's savings have not yet been allocated.
TPL is also pursuing new automated book return systems in larger branches (that sort by section and order the books, saving staff time)
They have already aggressively pursued energy efficiency in all branches.
There are very few branches that I think justify closure based on their usage levels. I would agree to one off-hand, which is the Todmorden room in the East York Community Centre. However, the annual savings would likely be under 100K, I think its 1 staff person and some rent/materials cost.
But, the reason that branch is still open, is because Pape/Danforth is grossly over crowed and used to the max; and its expansion was taken out of the budget several years ago.
So one does have to ask, if the closure of one, was contingent on the multi-million dollar expansion of another branch, how beneficial that would be the budget, at least in the short-term.
Firstly, its a comparatively cheap service in the scheme of things, just over the 100M mark, in a 9B budget.
Second, its one of the most cost-efficient. To their credit, TPL has been aggressively installing automatic check-outs which reduce the need for staff (under Miller the savings were reinvested in additional open hours); this year's savings have not yet been allocated.
TPL is also pursuing new automated book return systems in larger branches (that sort by section and order the books, saving staff time)
They have already aggressively pursued energy efficiency in all branches.
There are very few branches that I think justify closure based on their usage levels. I would agree to one off-hand, which is the Todmorden room in the East York Community Centre. However, the annual savings would likely be under 100K, I think its 1 staff person and some rent/materials cost.
But, the reason that branch is still open, is because Pape/Danforth is grossly over crowed and used to the max; and its expansion was taken out of the budget several years ago.
So one does have to ask, if the closure of one, was contingent on the multi-million dollar expansion of another branch, how beneficial that would be the budget, at least in the short-term.
The following is an email I just received from OurPublicLibraries.to. According to this email, cost-saving measures were suggested, but to no avail. So, here is a group acknowledging that times are tough and making positive suggestions, but it would seem that Mr. Mayor and his cronies have their minds made up. Are they really interested in saving money, or are they just interested in pushing through their agenda???
Marko
Active Member
Considering that final decisions are a month away, the comment about "arms being twisted and horses being traded" stood out to me. I know it's not "playing nice", but the threat of closure is still the best way to leverage other savings or concessions.
jje1000
Senior Member
http://www.citytv.com/toronto/cityn...-re-not-cutting-libraries-mayor-rob-ford-says
No libraries to be closed, says Ford. Of course, hours will be reduced and staffing slashed, cause that's the less divisive and flashy side of things.
No libraries to be closed, says Ford. Of course, hours will be reduced and staffing slashed, cause that's the less divisive and flashy side of things.
Bogtrotter
Senior Member
Many TPL librarians already seem to be working p/t hours- yikes.
fiendishlibrarian
Active Member
The vast majority of TPL librarians *are* part-time. There are endless, totally useless job postings for those positions on various library jobsites that those in the know don't bother applying to, as they are all spoken for and are formalities that must be publicly posted as per the collective agreement. Most of the librarian hires (at least those I've heard of) at TPL these days are from the internal ranks (long-serving pages, para-professional staff, etc.), many of whom either aren't actual librarians or have gone through U of T's iSchool on TPL's (i.e. ours') dime and thus became eligible for the librarian positions. It's a long-held sore spot amongst newly-minted librarians trying to get into TPL, and you learn very quickly whether you're on the ins or outs with that organization.
I'm as big an advocate for libraries as you'll get, obviously, but there *are* some things at TPL that need to be looked at.
I'm as big an advocate for libraries as you'll get, obviously, but there *are* some things at TPL that need to be looked at.
Bogtrotter
Senior Member
Wow, I didn't realize it was that bad there. In my experience that is common for government positions. Are a lot of FIS graduates still going to the States? I know in the 90's it was quite high.
fiendishlibrarian
Active Member
Not that I've heard. Library systems in the US have just been decimated over the past few years and if anything I've run into a lot of American librarians who found work here. The pay in Canada, whether in public or other libraries, is much higher than down there as well.
With regards to hiring: having worked in provincial, federal, and academic libraries, I can tell you that the hiring practices at TPL are much more shady than at any other place I've worked in. It's a closed shop, to a large degree, whereas you do face relatively honest, open competition for jobs in other parts of the public sector, certainly moreso in the corporate law library I work at now. And, to be blunt, as a straight-white male I'm not exactly the person they're looking for in a job requiring fluent Tamil and Urdu in a TPL branch in, say, Don Mills.
With regards to hiring: having worked in provincial, federal, and academic libraries, I can tell you that the hiring practices at TPL are much more shady than at any other place I've worked in. It's a closed shop, to a large degree, whereas you do face relatively honest, open competition for jobs in other parts of the public sector, certainly moreso in the corporate law library I work at now. And, to be blunt, as a straight-white male I'm not exactly the person they're looking for in a job requiring fluent Tamil and Urdu in a TPL branch in, say, Don Mills.
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