[toforumer]

Quebec City has to be on crack if they think they have a chance at 2022.

Quebec City to decide within a week on 2022 Olympic bid

QUEBEC — Quebec City will decide by next week if it is entering the race to host the Winter Olympic Games in 2022 after it conducts a thorough analysis of the decision to award the 2018 Games to Pyeongchang, South Korea.

The International Olympic Committee announced Wednesday that Pyeongchang won the bid over Munich, Germany, and the French city of Annecy.

Quebec City mayor Regis Labeaume recently said his decision to bid for the 2022 Games would be influenced by the 2018 host. He has said the project would be dealt a serious blow if Pyeongchang were chosen because a European city would more likely be favoured the next time around.

Labeaume's press secretary said Wednesday the mayor will meet with Quebec Premier Jean Charest, members of the Olympic task force Team Quebec and Marcel Aubut, president of the Canadian Olympic Committee.

"We will take the time to think this through before making a decision, and we have other people to consult," said Paul Christian Nolin.

He said the decision will be made within a week, adding there is no truth to media reports the city has already decided against the Olympic bid.

Aubut is in Durban, South Africa, for the unveiling of the 2018 host and will gather insight to help the city make a its decision.

Charest rekindled hopes for the Olympic flame in 2010 when he created Team Quebec with the goal of landing the 2022 or 2026 Winter Olympics in Quebec City.

The premier has said several times he "dreams" of bringing the Winter Games to the provincial capital.

Quebec City's bid to host the 2002 Winter Olympics was brushed aside in favour of Salt Lake City by the IOC.

The city tried again to present a candidacy for the 2010 Games but the Canadian Olympic Committee chose Vancouver as the country's candidate.

 

[Thanos]

"The city tried again to present a candidacy for the 2010 Games but the Canadian Olympic Committee chose Vancouver as the country's candidate."

And if they're brushed aside for Toronto 2020 then prepare for the all rumbling nonsense from the politicians in the province.
If Toronto goes for 2020 I really don't see the COC putting any effort for any games for at least a decade.

 

[Kitsune]

fully agree .... after 2020, there wont be room for another canadian bid till the late 2030s/ early 2040s imo.

 

[TOareaFan]

fully agree .... after 2020, there wont be room for another canadian bid till the late 2030s/ early 2040s imo.

It really depends how all future bids roll out. Unlike the summer games, there really are a limited number of developed/organized countries that can (or would want to) host the winter games. If, as is likelly, the award of the 2018 to South Korea leads to a Euro winner for 2022 (winter games were last in Europe in 2006) then where do they go in 2026? It would have been 3 winter games since Van/Whistler....one (2014) on the Europe/Asia border....one (2018) in Asia and one (2022) deep in the heart of Europe.

When the bidding comes up for 2026 (2019?) if there are no "knockout" competitors from the western hemisphere (a US city?) then why would you not take a run at a QC bid for 2026?

I have long believed that one of the things that works against Toronto in our bids for summer games is that the IOC sees Canada as a safe "go to" country to host winter games.....the games get a higher profile here than they would elsewhere and, unlike just about anywhere else, the big team sports of hockey and curling get to raise a ton of money in ticket sales (sorta like basketball and soccer do for the summer games)......I always think part of their reluctance to give us summer games (not total but part) is that they like to keep us in emergency reserve to host winter games.

I also believe that if QC could get the hill issue sorted out (as I understand it their main ski areas are close but not quite there with regards to Olympic standards) there would be no better city in North America (perhaps the world) to host the winter games.

 

[jn_12]

We shouldn't be just talking about the atmosphere of the bids. Toronto is in the same boat as Madrid - having submitted two, very strong bids. Rome and Madrid both suffer from absolutely devastated national economies. Italy's is systemic and long term, while Spain's is a result of decades of overspending and artificially propping up their economic growth. These two shouldn't even be bidding in the first place, but as it's Southern Europe, I don't expect much thought goes into any decision relating to spending. Tokyo is now hampered by the 2018 win. South Korea and Japan are often considered as a package, and the IOC will not be awarding games that are a few hundred kilometres apart within 2 years.

If Toronto mounts a solid bid like the 2008 one, given Canada's position as a very reliable partner for the IOC and the COC's growing influence within that organization, I don't see how Toronto 2020 wouldn't equal a strong bid. The anti-SOG protests in Spain would be disastrous. Their youth are already crying bloody murder with Spain's spending, now imagine if this group mired by <50% unemployment are told the government will be spending an additional 10 billion euros for a 3 week circus? Eeesh. I lived in Madrid, the guys there would tear the city apart.

I agree with you that those concerns should knock Madrid down a notch, but I don't think the IOC cares. They'll gladly eat into a country's economic well-being as long as the stadiums and venues get built. The other thing is 2020 is 9 years away and the economy of any nation can improve or decline in that span of time, and for the IOC to only look at the current economic climate is a bit short sighted.

 

[Filip]

I agree with you that those concerns should knock Madrid down a notch, but I don't think the IOC cares. They'll gladly eat into a country's economic well-being as long as the stadiums and venues get built. The other thing is 2020 is 9 years away and the economy of any nation can improve or decline in that span of time, and for the IOC to only look at the current economic climate is a bit short sighted.

That's true, but the nature of Spain's economic problems is that their stellar growth and rise from a post-Franco disaster to the Iberian tiger was fairly artificial. Fueled by real estate speculation and construction, lots and lots of construction. New airports, hundreds of kilometres of metro, hundreds of kilometres of LRT, just construction EVERYWHERE, and a lot of it public. The banks were generous with lending for private speculative developments. There's a ghost town of about 10,000 units outside of Madrid that was built without connections to the municipal infrastructure (no hydro, water, etc) so now it sits empty after costing hundreds of millions of euros!

If their unemployment is a sign of things to come (still rising after passing 23% recently), their youth is even more disenfranchised, with unemployment well over 50%. There are no opportunities, the state has stopped spending on infrastructure which has decimated their construction sector, the main propellant of their GDP growth. They are so very screwed it's not even funny. Spain's potential collapse would tear the Eurozone and EU apart as a bailout for Spain would cost 10x,20x the amount for Greece.

Their problems will persist for decades. I think Spain is now going to enter Italy's phase of blah that started in the early 90s. In fact, given that they don't have the national champions Italy did, I feel they will fare far worse. It was artificial growth; Spain's productivity and colossal trade deficit/sovereign debt will be its undoing. I don't see them getting back on their feet for at least another decade.

 

[Kitsune]

It really depends how all future bids roll out. Unlike the summer games, there really are a limited number of developed/organized countries that can (or would want to) host the winter games. If, as is likelly, the award of the 2018 to South Korea leads to a Euro winner for 2022 (winter games were last in Europe in 2006) then where do they go in 2026? It would have been 3 winter games since Van/Whistler....one (2014) on the Europe/Asia border....one (2018) in Asia and one (2022) deep in the heart of Europe.

When the bidding comes up for 2026 (2019?) if there are no "knockout" competitors from the western hemisphere (a US city?) then why would you not take a run at a QC bid for 2026?

I have long believed that one of the things that works against Toronto in our bids for summer games is that the IOC sees Canada as a safe "go to" country to host winter games.....the games get a higher profile here than they would elsewhere and, unlike just about anywhere else, the big team sports of hockey and curling get to raise a ton of money in ticket sales (sorta like basketball and soccer do for the summer games)......I always think part of their reluctance to give us summer games (not total but part) is that they like to keep us in emergency reserve to host winter games.

I also believe that if QC could get the hill issue sorted out (as I understand it their main ski areas are close but not quite there with regards to Olympic standards) there would be no better city in North America (perhaps the world) to host the winter games.

but remember... QC was third in voting behind both Calgary and Vancouver for the 2010 bid (and an interesting tidbit... Van wanted to bid for 08, and thats why we ended up with a Toronto bid for 08). And QC's previous solution was to extend the hill into the st. lawrence using barges (it came out midway through there 02 bid the hill was just too short). I just dont see it ever happening... until the closing of the atlantic causes the laurentians to rise again

 

[jn_12]

That's true, but the nature of Spain's economic problems is that their stellar growth and rise from a post-Franco disaster to the Iberian tiger was fairly artificial. Fueled by real estate speculation and construction, lots and lots of construction. New airports, hundreds of kilometres of metro, hundreds of kilometres of LRT, just construction EVERYWHERE, and a lot of it public. The banks were generous with lending for private speculative developments. There's a ghost town of about 10,000 units outside of Madrid that was built without connections to the municipal infrastructure (no hydro, water, etc) so now it sits empty after costing hundreds of millions of euros!

If their unemployment is a sign of things to come (still rising after passing 23% recently), their youth is even more disenfranchised, with unemployment well over 50%. There are no opportunities, the state has stopped spending on infrastructure which has decimated their construction sector, the main propellant of their GDP growth. They are so very screwed it's not even funny. Spain's potential collapse would tear the Eurozone and EU apart as a bailout for Spain would cost 10x,20x the amount for Greece.

Their problems will persist for decades. I think Spain is now going to enter Italy's phase of blah that started in the early 90s. In fact, given that they don't have the national champions Italy did, I feel they will fare far worse. It was artificial growth; Spain's productivity and colossal trade deficit/sovereign debt will be its undoing. I don't see them getting back on their feet for at least another decade.

I think all of those are great points, but I guess what I'm getting at is that the Spanish government would have to back Madrid's bid. If they bid, and won, it would be difficult to renege on that commitment. It has happened before when Denver won the 1976 Games and then gave up the Games after a referendum was held, but it seems like that would be a difficult move to make given that the Summer Olympics are the biggest spectacle in the world and in 1976 the winter games were a tiny afterthought. Bidding and then pulling the plug would be disasterous for Spain. Mind you, apparently they haven't officially declared their intentions yet, but the Spanish Olympic Committee has declared that they want to bid. So perhaps all of this discussion means nothing.

 

[toforumer]

The focus should be on obtaining a Summer Olympics. Why must we try and win another Winter Olympics in such a short time span? It makes absolutely no sense. We have Winter sporting venues for training and development out in the West, not 1 but 2 locations in Vancouver and Calgary. There's no rush to invest in more Winter sporting facilities anytime soon. The country needs Summer facility investments.

 

[toforumer]

Let's take a look at the bidding field for 2020.

Official
Rome, Italy - Still the only bid officially submitted to the IOC


Rumored/Pending Approval:

Toronto, Canada - Solid bid based on 2008's with some changes would compete for the win. The bid officials need to work on its relationships with IOC members. It would be a tough battle but is winnable in the end. There is no clear cut "Beijing" favourite this time.

Madrid,Spain - Waiting for government approval. Government will probably receiving heck from a good chunk of their population with the money being spent on this considering how horrible their economy is right now.

Doha, Qatar - Qatar recently won a FIFA World Cup, even though bribery allegedly took place. I still see them putting forth a bid. I doubt they get shortlisted. The IOC will want to stay far away from a city that is known to have bribed FIFA for that tournament now.

Dubai, United Arab Emirates - UAE has shitloads of money which the IOC loves. The dates of the games will probably lie outside the normal schedule which the IOC does not like. It's too hot here during the normal schedule. I doubt it being shortlisted especially after the city dropped the 2013 World Aquatics Championships.

Istanbul, Turkey - Previous Olympic bidder, has built up infrastructure which has been its biggest downfall from its previous bids. Their bid still won't match a quality bid from let's say a Toronto, Rome or Madrid bid. However, I could see them having a good shot as it's a new destination, between Europe & Asia.

Delhi, India - After the mediocre hosting and near disaster preparation for the 2010 Commonwealth Games, I highly doubt Delhi will be near the shortlist. They have a lot of things to work out.

Casablanca, Morocco - Doubt this bid goes that far. If the IOC wants a first African Olympics, it will be in South Africa.

Status Unknown yet:

Tokyo, Japan - but it looks like they won't be submitting anymore after Pyeongchang's win

Cancelled

Busan, South Korea

Prague, Czech Republic

South Africa

United States

 

[Filip]

I had no idea the COC was headquartered on St. Clair. I had always thought they were in Montreal.

Gamesbids rumour: The IOC will be in town soon to award the Canadian media rights for the upcoming Olympics, the announcement should be made then.

 

[Thanos]

Madrid, Tokyo and Istanbul are all official.

I don't see Tokyo having a shot with South Korea getting the WOG.
And something tells me France will somehow influence the games not going to Europe because they would die for 2024.
Knowing how the IOC works, Istanbul has a good shot.
What could work in Toronto's favor is 3rd time's the charm a la Pyeongchang.

 

[jn_12]

Madrid, Tokyo and Istanbul are all official.

I don't see Tokyo having a shot with South Korea getting the WOG.
And something tells me France will somehow influence the games not going to Europe because they would die for 2024.
Knowing how the IOC works, Istanbul has a good shot.
What could work in Toronto's favor is 3rd time's the charm a la Pyeongchang.

It would be Madrid's 3rd time bidding in a row a la Pyeongchang.
That is a good point about France/Paris and 2024, but the IOC isn't known for being sentimental when it comes to its choices. If they wouldn't give the 100th anniversary of the Olympics to Athens, they aren't likely to be compelled to use the 100th anniversary of the 1924 Paris games as a reason for them to host.

 

[Thanos]

I agree jn, however the main difference is Greece yields no power. France on the other is arguably the most influential European nation over the past 2-3 years, I'm using the IMF and the euro crisis as examples.
Just like South Africa was a shoo-in for 2020, i see Paris as a shoo-in for 2024.

 

[Towered]

You guys are forgetting the huge advantage Toronto has in that no North American city has hosted since 1996, and the US won't be bidding for 2020. I honestly think 2020 is Toronto's to lose.