DavidH
Senior Member
No, it would turn Eglinton into another operating division of Metrolinx, with its own President.
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Dan416
Senior Member
I don't think anyone is denying that the province has the power to do such a thing. The province can amalgamate cities on a whim.
I think the province knows it would be political suicide to try such a thing. And really, they have no desire or want to anyway, so why would they?
I was just curious if it was possible. I wasn't trying to insinuate that it was practical in the least.
drum118
Superstar
If this was not an election year and if there was an extra 2 years before one, the province would told where Ford could go and start building any of TC lines over the objection of the city and Ford.
There is always a price to pay at the end of the day for a move like this and you must weigh the the pros and cons for making that move in the first place.
Rainforest
Senior Member
Even with no elections looming, in doing so the provincial government would have to overcome many logistic difficulties, without much political capital earned. Normally, the city's departments handle associated tasks such as property acquisitions, utility relocations, landscaping, rezoning etc. If the province decided to go alone, it would have to create its own departments for those tasks, or direct the city's departments ... too tedious.
It would be a lot easier for the province to just reallocate the transit funding to local projects in other cities, and GO expansion / electrification.
rbt
Senior Member
The province would not do any of this. The province would simply make it law that the city must perform the tasks.
Think of the OMB and how they can and regularly do force the city to grant permits, easements, and perform tasks similar to what you outlined above.
If the province added a single line to the City of Toronto Act making it law that the city must obey Metrolinx in the same way that they must obey the OMB, it becomes trivial for Metrolinx to delegate all of that work down.
This isn't any different than pushing down the requirement to add accessibility to all subway stations with a set timeline and significantly easier than when amalgamation was pushed through.
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TransitPolicyChanger
Active Member
I would say this is totally different than that. To have the Province take over control of Eglinton, all the buried and overhead services, buildings, maintenance, etc., then construct and operate a transit line on a City Street is very different than demanding the City install elevators and purchase low floor buses for the transit system. There is no way any provincial government would try to pull that off. The original plan was to provide the City the money to build the lines, let the TTC build and operate the lines and the Province would retain ownership. They were never to own the entire street and the mess that surrounds owning it. Then if this was a provincial line, would you have fare integration? Would the TTC allow for a direct connection to their lines?
Too many issues and road blocks to say any of this could happen if the City of Toronto didn't want it to (as stupid as Ford is to not want this line built, at least not the portion from Jane to Leslie)
Mike in TO
Senior Member
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Mike in TO
Senior Member
Queen’s Park and city have a $12.4B TTC deal
Robert Benzie
Queen's Park Bureau Chief
Tess Kalinowski Transportation Reporter
The Better Way will get a lot bigger under a new $12.4 billion plan to extend the Sheppard subway line in both directions and build a new Eglinton light rail line from Jane St. to Kennedy station, the Star has learned.
Premier Dalton McGuinty is to announce Thursday that the province is giving Toronto $8.2 billion to pay for the TTC’s new 20-km Eglinton Crosstown Metro. It would run underground all the way from Black Creek to Scarborough Centre and continue above ground along the existing Scarborough Rapid Transit route, which would be converted to the same LRT technology.
But it will be up to Mayor Rob Ford and city council to determine how to finance the $4.2 billion it will cost for the Sheppard subway extensions he wants to build west to Downsview station and east to Scarborough Centre.
Questions remain about whether it is feasible to raise that much money using development charges and tax increment financing to boost the Toronto Transit Commission.
“There are only four ways to do it: existing revenue tools, like property taxes; a private-public partnership; increased federal funding; or, down the road, some kind of new funding arrangement with the province,†one source confided.
The provincial funding had previously been earmarked for Transit City, which was a plan for more extensive light rail on Eglinton, Sheppard, Finch and the Scarborough RT.
But Ford declared that deal dead as soon as he took office last October, vowing there would be no more tracks down the middle of Toronto’s streets like the St. Clair Ave. line.
As a result of the mayor’s objections, the proposed Finch line from the upcoming Finch West station to Humber College has been scrapped.
While Transportation Minister Kathleen Wynne was tight-lipped Wednesday, she confirmed a deal was “close.â€
“There’s no more money, but on the Eglinton line we want to get going,†said Wynne, mindful that the Liberals hold 19 of Toronto’s 23 seats and face re-election on Oct. 6.
“It’s been a back and forth conversation for a number of weeks,†she said of the weeks of ongoing negotiations between Queen’s Park and city hall.
“The whole point of this ... has been to find the common ground, to find a way to preserve our principles and to allow the city to move forward on what it wants to do.â€
Construction will start this year, with completion set for 2020.
Ford’s dream of an extended Sheppard subway will be the city’s $4.2 billion responsibility alone — in the west, it will run 5.45 km from Downsview station to Yonge; in the east, it will go from Don Mills to Scarborough Centre. It should be finished in 2019.
The plan would take traffic off the Bloor-Danforth line, according to one provincial source. Studies show many people would switch to Eglinton to travel to the Yonge and Eglinton area.
Under former mayor David Miller’s administration, Metrolinx was prepared to fund about 56 km of light rail on separate lanes running down the middle of the road by about the end of the decade.
The idea was to enhance the commutes of residents living in some of Toronto’s priority neighbourhoods such as Jane and Finch, where transit access and social services are scarce.
Light rail advocates argue that such lines encourage mid-rise development that leads to livelier, pedestrian friendly streetscapes.
Ford — and those who voted for him — disagreed, saying construction snarled traffic and removed precious lane space from busy city streets.
In a major concession, meanwhile, the TTC will abandon its “open payment†smartcard and work with Metrolinx to implement the Presto fare card already in use.
“That’s a big win,†said one provincial insider, recalling the feud between Queen’s Park and the previous TTC administration over Presto.
Robert Benzie
Queen's Park Bureau Chief
Tess Kalinowski Transportation Reporter
The Better Way will get a lot bigger under a new $12.4 billion plan to extend the Sheppard subway line in both directions and build a new Eglinton light rail line from Jane St. to Kennedy station, the Star has learned.
Premier Dalton McGuinty is to announce Thursday that the province is giving Toronto $8.2 billion to pay for the TTC’s new 20-km Eglinton Crosstown Metro. It would run underground all the way from Black Creek to Scarborough Centre and continue above ground along the existing Scarborough Rapid Transit route, which would be converted to the same LRT technology.
But it will be up to Mayor Rob Ford and city council to determine how to finance the $4.2 billion it will cost for the Sheppard subway extensions he wants to build west to Downsview station and east to Scarborough Centre.
Questions remain about whether it is feasible to raise that much money using development charges and tax increment financing to boost the Toronto Transit Commission.
“There are only four ways to do it: existing revenue tools, like property taxes; a private-public partnership; increased federal funding; or, down the road, some kind of new funding arrangement with the province,†one source confided.
The provincial funding had previously been earmarked for Transit City, which was a plan for more extensive light rail on Eglinton, Sheppard, Finch and the Scarborough RT.
But Ford declared that deal dead as soon as he took office last October, vowing there would be no more tracks down the middle of Toronto’s streets like the St. Clair Ave. line.
As a result of the mayor’s objections, the proposed Finch line from the upcoming Finch West station to Humber College has been scrapped.
While Transportation Minister Kathleen Wynne was tight-lipped Wednesday, she confirmed a deal was “close.â€
“There’s no more money, but on the Eglinton line we want to get going,†said Wynne, mindful that the Liberals hold 19 of Toronto’s 23 seats and face re-election on Oct. 6.
“It’s been a back and forth conversation for a number of weeks,†she said of the weeks of ongoing negotiations between Queen’s Park and city hall.
“The whole point of this ... has been to find the common ground, to find a way to preserve our principles and to allow the city to move forward on what it wants to do.â€
Construction will start this year, with completion set for 2020.
Ford’s dream of an extended Sheppard subway will be the city’s $4.2 billion responsibility alone — in the west, it will run 5.45 km from Downsview station to Yonge; in the east, it will go from Don Mills to Scarborough Centre. It should be finished in 2019.
The plan would take traffic off the Bloor-Danforth line, according to one provincial source. Studies show many people would switch to Eglinton to travel to the Yonge and Eglinton area.
Under former mayor David Miller’s administration, Metrolinx was prepared to fund about 56 km of light rail on separate lanes running down the middle of the road by about the end of the decade.
The idea was to enhance the commutes of residents living in some of Toronto’s priority neighbourhoods such as Jane and Finch, where transit access and social services are scarce.
Light rail advocates argue that such lines encourage mid-rise development that leads to livelier, pedestrian friendly streetscapes.
Ford — and those who voted for him — disagreed, saying construction snarled traffic and removed precious lane space from busy city streets.
In a major concession, meanwhile, the TTC will abandon its “open payment†smartcard and work with Metrolinx to implement the Presto fare card already in use.
“That’s a big win,†said one provincial insider, recalling the feud between Queen’s Park and the previous TTC administration over Presto.
nfitz
Superstar
Did you catch the name in there? Eglinton Crosstown Metro
As opposed to LRT or RT.
I wonder if it still includes the long-awaited for extension from McCowan to Sheppard ... which is really a pittance compared to the $8-billion budget.
As opposed to LRT or RT.
I wonder if it still includes the long-awaited for extension from McCowan to Sheppard ... which is really a pittance compared to the $8-billion budget.
Ramako
Moderator
Even though the Eglinton line isn't technically a subway, would it show up on the subway maps like the Scarborough RT does?
nfitz
Superstar
I don't see why it wouldn't. The Scarborough RT isn't technically a subway either. Though we've got a decade to worry about this!
I would hope that it would. From what I can tell, at least for the SLRT part, they haven't changed much from what was proposed in TC.
Amy Rose
Active Member
last time I heard, it went to Sheppard and STC- McCowan portion gets demolished, and that is with LRT technology, HRT technology only goes to STC
Dan416
Senior Member
If the stop spacing is subway-like I see no reason not to include this line I don't agree with on the subway maps.