[kkgg7]

Canada needs to be more like Australia. Everyone wants to visit Australia, they have created a mystique about their country despite the fact that Australia hasn't contributed much to world history or culture for which the average person would care about. Canada is in a similar situation. Why should we be a regional tourist destination? Toronto is the major Canadian city whom most people could name.

The rest of Canada likes to think that Torontonians believe they are the centre of the universe, it's time for us to actually act that way!

Australia has its advantage: weather. Both Sydney and Melbourne have fantastic weather. None of Canadian cities has that. The fact that Vancouver winter is considered "warm" sounds almost funny outside Canada.

In addtion, Australia is almost a continent itself (Oceania) and it dominates its region. While Canada, well, as know, is and will always be overshadowed by something much bigger. When someone thinks about coming to North America, it is hard to give him a reason to choose among various American cities (which are usually cheaper to visit) than Toronto. That's why I always say, the greatest misfortune about Canada is that it is next to the world's greatest power, which means it will always be neglected to some extent. If Canada is located in Europe, it might be a much more interesting country instead of everything being Americanized.

I don't know where this "center of the universe" saying comes from. Toronto won't be the centre of anywhere except maybe the province of Ontario.

 

[jn_12]

Canada attracts roughly three times more visitors than Australia does (16.1million visitors compared to 5.89million).

 

[EMP1729]

Australia has its advantage: weather. Both Sydney and Melbourne have fantastic weather. None of Canadian cities has that. The fact that Vancouver winter is considered "warm" sounds almost funny outside Canada.

In addtion, Australia is almost a continent itself (Oceania) and it dominates its region. While Canada, well, as know, is and will always be overshadowed by something much bigger. When someone thinks about coming to North America, it is hard to give him a reason to choose among various American cities (which are usually cheaper to visit) than Toronto. That's why I always say, the greatest misfortune about Canada is that it is next to the world's greatest power, which means it will always be neglected to some extent. If Canada is located in Europe, it might be a much more interesting country instead of everything being Americanized.

I don't know where this "center of the universe" saying comes from. Toronto won't be the centre of anywhere except maybe the province of Ontario.

See, I don't want to single you out, KKGG7, but this attitude is part of the problem with Torontonians - such a defeatist attitude.

 

[Thanos]

I would call kkgg many things but defeatist is not one of them. He reminds me a lot of Jean Drapeau, the old Montreal mayor.

Jn, what are the number of international tourists (ie: non US)? We have the advantage that Americans can just hop on their car and come over. Whereas Australia you really have to go out of your way to get there and for that reason i'm assuming there are a lot less people who will go there for a weekend. And let's not forget it's not exactly a cheap and short flight for north Americans and Europeans. Also, Candians need a visa to go visit. Do Americans and Europeans need one as well?

 

[junctionist]

See, I don't want to single you out, KKGG7, but this attitude is part of the problem with Torontonians - such a defeatist attitude.

Still, it doesn't help when you assume Canada as not having contributed much to world, when it has many cultural, scientific, industrial, and sports achievements. Some of these are world famous, while others deserve more promotion.

 

[EMP1729]

I never assumed nor said that Canada (or even Australia) has not contributed anything significant to world history. Only that the average person does not care about such achievements. There is a difference there. I am pretty proud of my country.

We do need to promote our country. The whole point is that we haven't done a good job. And yes, I agree with KKGG7 that being neighbours with the US isn't easy, however, it shouldn't be a reason not to try.

 

[kkgg7]

Canada attracts roughly three times more visitors than Australia does (16.1million visitors compared to 5.89million).

Your numbers are useless to be honest and sheds no light in terms the attractiveness of each country as a tourist destination. An American can come to Niagara Falls for 4 hours on a weekend and counts as 1 "visitor", which I believe happens all the time, yet you will be hard pressed to find anyway fly all the way to Sydney and fly back 4 hours later. Australia has no neighbour on its land.

To be more precise with the comparison, it makes sense to compare the tourism revenue, instead of number of visitors.

Canada: Total tourism gross domestic product (GDP) hit $29.7 billion in 2010, equal to 2% of the overall national GDP.
http://en-corporate.canada.travel/content/ctc_news/tourism-snapshot-2010-year-review

Australian: In the financial year 2010/11, the tourism industry represented 2.5% of Australia's GDP at a value of approximately A$35 billion to the national economy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tourism_in_Australia

in 2010, AUD has been consistently between 0.9-1 CAD, so exchange rate is not so much of an issue.
http://www.exchangerates.org.uk/AUD-CAD-exchange-rate-history.html#AUD-CAD-history-table

In that sense, tourism revenue in both countries are basically the same. However, considering Canada had 3 times as many visitors, the logic conclusion is that a visitor spent 3 times more money in Australia than in Canada.

 

[Tewder]

Again, it comes back to brand and message. Americans have spent over 200 years building up a very strong one internationally. Canada hasn't, nor Toronto. Outside of Quebec there is little understanding of what a Canadian identity might even be... and it isn't helpful that we tend to define ourselves by what we're not... and it isn't helpful that we cling to Multiculturalism as an identity when it is the opposite of one.

 

[kkgg7]

Economist had an article about revenue per visitor across countries, and Australia seems to lead the pack and Canada is nowhere to be seen.

http://www.economist.com/blogs/dailychart/2011/07/tourist-arrivals-and-revenues

I am not a "defeatist", but in terms of attracting overseas visitors to spend money, Australia did a far superior job than Canada.

 

[vatche]

Guys lets face it, our weather has always throughout history been a hindrance to the growth of our country. It destroys our infrastructure, makes us hibernate, makes our cities unattractive, makes people emigrate out
Of the country. Australia is always sunny and warm.. We realistically only have 4-5 months of tourist season. how can we compare ourselves with them. People in general love warm sunny climates when they go on vacation.. And Toronto isn't warm and sunny in April.

 

[jn_12]

I think the numbers are a bit misleading simply because of Australia's unique position in the world. The cost just to get to Australia is more than most people would spend on a trip to Canada. People tend to stay longer on trips to Australia as well just because of the time it takes to get there. I don't disagree at all that Australia is a top-notch tourist destination and they've done a decent job with their brand, but you're talking about a remote destination for just about everyone in the world, which has a huge impact on their revenues. By no means does this suggest they have a better product.

I would also agree that day-travel plays a big role in our numbers, but that's like anywhere in North America and Europe.

 

[Lenser]

... aside from rue St. Paul is Montreal really that European looking?

It's not so much how Montreal looks, it's more he whole vibe of the city itself. The psychology, the ambiance of the place. Way different from Toronto. Toronto is about business and status-seeking, whereas Montreal is about life. I know it's a hackneyed comparison, but it feels right to me. And don't get me wrong - I love Toronto, warts and all.

 

[vatche]

I've been living in Montreal since 1998. At first I didn't like it but now it grew on me and I like it more. One thing here is that people love to dress up and go out and have fun. They love to live and work comes next. Also Montreal did not grow like Toronto did. No tall buildings went up, no new condos. If any, very few. plus one thing I noticed is that, when they do something, or build something, they do it well. One very simple example is that they never close off their patio tables and even if they do, they use flower pots and do it with style, whereas in Toronto they use those ugly metal railings. I've seen it a lot in t.o. But rarely in Montreal. Plus it helps that they have old Montreal. It's charming, with old architecture. They add nice flowers in the summer, nice lightings, stylish, sexy patios. Last time I was in Toronto , I saw patios, but they weren't well done. Although I saw a pic of la societe's patio and it looked cool. Sassafras too.

 

[kkgg7]

I think the numbers are a bit misleading simply because of Australia's unique position in the world. The cost just to get to Australia is more than most people would spend on a trip to Canada. People tend to stay longer on trips to Australia as well just because of the time it takes to get there. I don't disagree at all that Australia is a top-notch tourist destination and they've done a decent job with their brand, but you're talking about a remote destination for just about everyone in the world, which has a huge impact on their revenues. By no means does this suggest they have a better product.

I would also agree that day-travel plays a big role in our numbers, but that's like anywhere in North America and Europe.

A remote place for everyone in the world? For Asian countries such as China, it is actually a lot closer to fly to Austria than North America, especially east coast.

Hong Kong to Sydney - 9 hours, to Toronto 15 hours, to Vancouver 13 hours.
Shanghai to Sydney - 10.5 hours, Toronto - 14.5 hours

You should know by now that the world is not just about North America and Europe, at least not any more.

 

[vatche]

And I think if I'm not mistaken, I read somewhere that the number one source of tourists in Australia is china!!