christiesplits
Senior Member
Thank you kotsy and AOD.
innsertnamehere
Superstar
the glass atrium will be done for the pan ams, not the shed.
The new concourse, the first phase of the NW PATH connection, and the TTC second platform will be finished for the Pan Ams.
The new concourse, the first phase of the NW PATH connection, and the TTC second platform will be finished for the Pan Ams.
nfitz
Superstar
The second platform has been substantially finished for some time. It's the rebuild of the first platform that should be finished by the Pan Ams.
kotsy
Senior Member
Right, that's what I mean. And the mess upstairs in the mezzanine level should be finished as well.
wopchop
Building Toronto
In other news, a few of my colleagues attended a tender call on March 31 for Stage 2 & 3 of the revitalization, which is the Bay Concourse work (stage 2) and the connection to the TTC station (stage 3). I believe that the tenders are due April 29th, so handover will likely be imminent after that.
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ttk77
Senior Member
I believe they've indicated that the the Bay St. Concourse work will not start until after the games so that both concourses can be open to handle the extra traffic.
wopchop
Building Toronto
Ah, ok. I wasn't aware of that. Thanks for the info.
I'm not involved personally with the bid, so didn't know all the nitty gritty details.
mdrejhon
Senior Member
It wasn't the original plan but I think it was a recent decision. It makes a lot of sense, given the revitalization delays and the increased freeway congestion may create a surge of GO traffic. It is an excellent idea, due to the current timing of York concourse opening. It only delays the Bay shutdown by a few months, and allows the Union food businesses a less disruptive transition between the Bay shutdown and the partial opening of the brand new food court in the York lower concourse. Kudos for that last-minute decision to turn the delay lemon into lemonade.
I hope they can finish revitalizing the exterior so there's no scaffolds outside Union this summer, showing off a prettier Union on Front street, with a fully functioning brand new York concourse. Even if the Bay moat probably won't be covered with glass yet (not a good idea if they still need to jackhammer/concretesaw to remove the moat stairs that are no longer needed between the subway and the future lower Bay concourse).
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wopchop
Building Toronto
Glass skylight for the moat definitely will not take place this summer. I believe that it that is part of Stage 3. Removing the temporary stairs between subway / current Bay concourse is definitely part of Stage 3, which will address the connection between new Bay Concourse and subway station.
I've looked at 2 or 3 different sets of preliminary drawings for the moat skylights over the last 3 years, and they were all tentatively scheduled for near the end of Union station Revitalization, at this point, probably mid-to-late 2016 to 2017.
Le Gique
Active Member
1. Delaying the closure of the Bay Concourse had to happen, IMO, not only to handle extra crowds but also because it seemed to be predicated on shutting Bay as soon as York opens. I had heard the switch was to take place on the same day or within days-- if true the intention may have been "pull-the-bandaid-off-quick" but could have caused untold chaos. This way people have an opportunity to find their way around York first.
2. Phase 1 of NW PATH: This means the walkways from the York Concourse to the Royal York? To the NW corner of York and Front? The Citigroup building? All three?
3. Moat skylights - both east and west?
What is the status of moat skylights from the York Concourse to the NW PATH, then? Does it make sense this will also be completed after York opens?
2. Phase 1 of NW PATH: This means the walkways from the York Concourse to the Royal York? To the NW corner of York and Front? The Citigroup building? All three?
3. Moat skylights - both east and west?
What is the status of moat skylights from the York Concourse to the NW PATH, then? Does it make sense this will also be completed after York opens?
wopchop
Building Toronto
As I mentioned, I believe that they are part of Stage 3 (after Bay Concourse), but I am not certain of that.
smallspy
Senior Member
York and Bay are getting done bit-by-bit as a portion of the "trainshed" work. Part of the scope involves removing the track and repairing the concrete trackwells, before waterproofing them.
Dan
Toronto, Ont.
mdrejhon
Senior Member
I was discussing with someone in a different forum, somebody who thinks Union is completely incapable of absorbing more peak-hour traffic. I made a number of bullet point arguments that New York Penn (of similar size as Union ~2025) is roughly the same size, but handles more peak hour traffic. He even claimed that only 13 tracks had platforms, while Penn had 21. This is actually outdated information, and not a fully accurate comparsion in my opinion.
There are 16 tracks going through Union, 15 of them with platforms (not all open simultaneously yet). Platform 3 could be made a berthable spot for eastbound services (since UPX takes the berth to the west), and there's now the new Platform 26/27 which was built to allow them to shut down other tracks at Union for revitalization. And Metrolinx 2031 plan includes the use of track sharing with VIA tracks, double berthing west of York. Some rejigging may be needed (e.g. letting some trains overhang Bay Street slightly, to make room two simultaneous 12-car GOtrains on the same track in the central trackage). All in all, this adds 3 more 12-car berths (three tracks capable of berthing two full length GOtrains), plus possibly 2 more shorter berths.
Once all this is done, Union will have roughly the same number of berths as New York's Penn Station. Also, a few tracks at Penn Station aren't through tracks, so this will more-or-less match up with the semi-dead-end nature of double berthing and Track 3, so this would be roughly parity. Semi-dead-end trackage can handle terminating services on one side (e.g. Richmond Hill line). All in all, this ensures roughly a doubling of passengers while keeping platform passenger density (per square meter) roughly the same as today, assuming all platforms are all opened and all the construction mess is gone.
Union revitalization also paves the way for doubling of peak-hour passengers:
- Triple square footage of GO concourse
- More logical concourse design. Less pedestrian criss-cross interference.
- New PATH connection.
- Dramatically wider TTC PATH to Union. Wider entrance, more doors into Union.
- Altogether, double total meters width of all PATH connections combined!
- Elimination of stairs between TTC and lower concourse which becomes indoors (dig-down levels the lower concourse)
- Separation of most food/concessions away from GO concourses. (Urban Eatery style food court under York concourse)
- No morning coffee lineups to interfere with people walking to/from platforms.
- Continuous wide hallway (clutter-free, no lineups, no concessions stands) between PATH/TTC and upper GO concourse
- More stairways and elevators to platforms.
- Frequent electric trains have shorter dwell time and faster acceleration, freeing berths faster for next train.
- USRC will be resignalled, allowing increased train throughput per track.
- Metrolinx is about to do an EA for Positive Train Control this year, also increased train throughput per track.
Four GO routes already get 15-minute-or-better service during peak. Case in point is Union already gets Lakeshore West service every 7.5 minutes with eight trains from 4:45pm to 5:45pm, Metrolinx is still managing to pull that off with the limited platforms (the shut-down trackages), so by 2025, more routes can gain 15-minute service simultaneously (possibly, almost all GO corridors during peak).
The new electricification initiative ($16.5bn) quadruples GO traffic into Union, but most of that is offpeak capacity easily being consumed, and supposedly increases peak traffic by only 40%, so that's still very manageable post-Revitalization, with a little bit more room (not that much) for further growth.
The extra berths, and the doubling of passenger input/output capacity into/out Union, is why I believe Union will be competitive in size to New York Penn within about ten years. For the current 10-year plan, we don't need the underground trackage yet -- existing Union will easily be able to handle the 1500 berthings per day, to 6000 berthings per day, in about 10 years (plus presumed construction delays). Anyone who disbelieves that, isn't realizing how much work is already being done to expand Union and USRC.
Any arguments for/against that?
There are 16 tracks going through Union, 15 of them with platforms (not all open simultaneously yet). Platform 3 could be made a berthable spot for eastbound services (since UPX takes the berth to the west), and there's now the new Platform 26/27 which was built to allow them to shut down other tracks at Union for revitalization. And Metrolinx 2031 plan includes the use of track sharing with VIA tracks, double berthing west of York. Some rejigging may be needed (e.g. letting some trains overhang Bay Street slightly, to make room two simultaneous 12-car GOtrains on the same track in the central trackage). All in all, this adds 3 more 12-car berths (three tracks capable of berthing two full length GOtrains), plus possibly 2 more shorter berths.
Once all this is done, Union will have roughly the same number of berths as New York's Penn Station. Also, a few tracks at Penn Station aren't through tracks, so this will more-or-less match up with the semi-dead-end nature of double berthing and Track 3, so this would be roughly parity. Semi-dead-end trackage can handle terminating services on one side (e.g. Richmond Hill line). All in all, this ensures roughly a doubling of passengers while keeping platform passenger density (per square meter) roughly the same as today, assuming all platforms are all opened and all the construction mess is gone.
Union revitalization also paves the way for doubling of peak-hour passengers:
- Triple square footage of GO concourse
- More logical concourse design. Less pedestrian criss-cross interference.
- New PATH connection.
- Dramatically wider TTC PATH to Union. Wider entrance, more doors into Union.
- Altogether, double total meters width of all PATH connections combined!
- Elimination of stairs between TTC and lower concourse which becomes indoors (dig-down levels the lower concourse)
- Separation of most food/concessions away from GO concourses. (Urban Eatery style food court under York concourse)
- No morning coffee lineups to interfere with people walking to/from platforms.
- Continuous wide hallway (clutter-free, no lineups, no concessions stands) between PATH/TTC and upper GO concourse
- More stairways and elevators to platforms.
- Frequent electric trains have shorter dwell time and faster acceleration, freeing berths faster for next train.
- USRC will be resignalled, allowing increased train throughput per track.
- Metrolinx is about to do an EA for Positive Train Control this year, also increased train throughput per track.
Four GO routes already get 15-minute-or-better service during peak. Case in point is Union already gets Lakeshore West service every 7.5 minutes with eight trains from 4:45pm to 5:45pm, Metrolinx is still managing to pull that off with the limited platforms (the shut-down trackages), so by 2025, more routes can gain 15-minute service simultaneously (possibly, almost all GO corridors during peak).
The new electricification initiative ($16.5bn) quadruples GO traffic into Union, but most of that is offpeak capacity easily being consumed, and supposedly increases peak traffic by only 40%, so that's still very manageable post-Revitalization, with a little bit more room (not that much) for further growth.
The extra berths, and the doubling of passenger input/output capacity into/out Union, is why I believe Union will be competitive in size to New York Penn within about ten years. For the current 10-year plan, we don't need the underground trackage yet -- existing Union will easily be able to handle the 1500 berthings per day, to 6000 berthings per day, in about 10 years (plus presumed construction delays). Anyone who disbelieves that, isn't realizing how much work is already being done to expand Union and USRC.
Any arguments for/against that?
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thenewguy
New Member
I'm not sure this has been seen before. Some renders for food services area on lower concourse. More pics on site:
http://www.partisanprojects.com/projects-index/union-station
http://www.partisanprojects.com/projects-index/union-station