micheal_can said:
It talks about the yard and how to get the trains around after the expand things with planned construction of certain lines. Not really sure how it is a fantasy.
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I think it's just about posting the "fantasy map" and that fact on its own (out of context) means it's in the wrong thread. Even though arrows are put in to indicate stuff.
 
TransitBart said:
In this case, suggest Yonge North be converted to Yonge North/Sheppard and then trains can be despached south from Richmond Hill, north and south from Wilson via Sheppard-Yonge, north and south from Davisville and on the western leg both north and south from Wilson. This would speed deployment for rush hour in a significant manner.
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So you'd like to see them spend another $2bil just to get trains into and out of service faster? Is that the wisest use of limited dollars?

Dan
Toronto, Ont.
 
I understand the CPR Train Yard (South of Finch, East of McCowan) has some space available.
  • B-D should be extended there.
  • Sheppard Subway could also use this yard after it is extended to STC.
 
smallspy said:
So you'd like to see them spend another $2bil just to get trains into and out of service faster? Is that the wisest use of limited dollars?

Dan
Toronto, Ont.
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This would be a good secondary benefit. I think that the money may well get spent and notwithstanding others' opinions here, I can't say I am in disagreement with a heavy rail cross city rapid transit solution at the north end of the city. It parallels the 401 and thus far, transit planning has not even begun to think about how to reduce our auto dependence on that.
 
Sandpit said:
He managed to make all proposed lines/extensions fit in a strip-style subway map. That is quite the achievement. Now to fit this above the doors...
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I stole the original map from Urban toronto and added in the Sheppard West Extension. I take no credit for that, I just used it as a template for trains being sent out of yards.
 
TransitBart said:
This would be a good secondary benefit. I think that the money may well get spent and notwithstanding others' opinions here, I can't say I am in disagreement with a heavy rail cross city rapid transit solution at the north end of the city. It parallels the 401 and thus far, transit planning has not even begun to think about how to reduce our auto dependence on that.
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If we convert the TYSSE to be a part of the Sheppard subway (which could be smart considering that it runs along Sheppard for quite a bit, has fairly low ridership, and shortens the YUS line), the following could occur:

1. Trains can be shortened to 4 cars, not having to waste electricity on the line for traction
2. The Sheppard subway in its current form would get significantly more ridership
3. It gives people the opportunity seamlessly connect the Yonge, Don Mills, and Spadina lines
4. Since Wilson is so large, it can either focus on dispatching southbound trains while a new yard is built along the TYSSE or the Sheppard Subway, or serve the Sheppard line and potentially the DRL along with the Spadina Line
5. Redundancy would be created in the network.
6. Removes the need for the York University Rocket to Sheppard Yonge Station
7. The Spadina Line would be shortened, meaning that dispatching and route management are significantly easier.
8. Eliminates a need for the short turns along the Yonge Line, and frees up 6-car trains for that line.
9. Increases space at Davisville for about 4 trains

Cons:
1. It would require a sheppard west extension (1-2B$)
2. It would require about a 100-150 M dollar retrofit of the existing Sheppard subway
3. A new interchange would need to be built at Sheppard West Station, the station would need a retrofit, and might have to be renamed (again).
4. Passengers travelling from Vaughan would need to transfer to get downtown, however, since it gives them three subway options, they can choose the route that serves them best. Sheppard West and Sheppard Yonge would be easy transfers since they're both not that deep underground. It could also provide eventual Spadina line relief, however, it can potentially risk the Yonge Line
5. Might be too much for Wilson to handle.
6. Could reduce Spadina subway ridership (however, it might be a benefit considering that it's supposed to be overcrowded within 20 years when something like this would be built).
 
I like the interline option - both north and south.

Pro:
  1. A 4 km extension from Yonge to Dufferin gets you 1 line from Don Mills to Vaughan (17km), and, Don Mills to Downtown (and around to Finch) (37km).
  2. Interchange at Sheppard West is built in green field of Downsview Airport north area - making it much easier with no traffic issues to worry about.
  3. With interlining, no real transfers at Sheppard West station. This allows new Sheppard platform to be built 100m to 200m east of existing station - much easier to just tunnel under existing station and not build a new station under. It would have a Spadina style transfer just in case (i.e. if closure happens on one line).
  4. The red line, a planned short turn, would run in rush hour from Allen-Sheppard (A-S) to Finch with 4 minute frequency - giving those south of here a chance at getting a seat. Sheppard would have trains at 2 minute frequency, with alternate trains heading north and south from A-S.
  5. At shoulder time, the red line would cease.
  6. Off peak, each of the yellow, blue and purple would run every 10 minutes. This means there is a train on Sheppard every 5 minutes, a train on the YUS (south of A-S) ever 5 minutes, and a train on YUS (north of A-S) every 5 minutes. Those on Sheppard and YUS (north of A-S) may only have every second train (i.e. every 10 minutes) going to their correct destination.
Con:
  1. At rush hour, the yellow line would run only every 8 minutes to serve Vaughan to Downtown. (If that doesn't meet the demand, a red line train can be switched with a yellow - giving Vaughan 4 minute service and a red line frequency of 8 minutes).
  2. Some extra cost to build the Allen-Sheppard interchange.
  3. The new Don Mills to Finch line is a bit long (especially if extended to STC and/or Richmond Hill).
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BurlOak said:
I like the interline option - both north and south.

Pro:
  1. A 4 km extension from Yonge to Dufferin gets you 1 line from Don Mills to Vaughan (17km), and, Don Mills to Downtown (and around to Finch) (37km).
  2. Interchange at Sheppard West is built in green field of Downsview Airport north area - making it much easier with no traffic issues to worry about.
  3. With interlining, no real transfers at Sheppard West station. This allows new Sheppard platform to be built 100m to 200m east of existing station - much easier to just tunnel under existing station and not build a new station under. It would have a Spadina style transfer just in case (i.e. if closure happens on one line).
  4. The red line, a planned short turn, would run in rush hour from Allen-Sheppard (A-S) to Finch with 4 minute frequency - giving those south of here a chance at getting a seat. Sheppard would have trains at 2 minute frequency, with alternate trains heading north and south from A-S.
  5. At shoulder time, the red line would cease.
  6. Off peak, each of the yellow, blue and purple would run every 10 minutes. This means there is a train on Sheppard every 5 minutes, a train on the YUS (south of A-S) ever 5 minutes, and a train on YUS (north of A-S) every 5 minutes. Those on Sheppard and YUS (north of A-S) may only have every second train (i.e. every 10 minutes) going to their correct destination.
Con:
  1. At rush hour, the yellow line would run only every 8 minutes to serve Vaughan to Downtown. (If that doesn't meet the demand, a red line train can be switched with a yellow - giving Vaughan 4 minute service and a red line frequency of 8 minutes).
  2. Some extra cost to build the Allen-Sheppard interchange.
  3. The new Don Mills to Finch line is a bit long (especially if extended to STC and/or Richmond Hill).
View attachment 138989
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This is too complicated both for the TTC and Toronto transit users.
 
hw621 said:
This is too complicated both for the TTC and Toronto transit users.
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Each line being its own colour (and letter*) is the key. Each line goes somewhere, and they are interlined at times. The trains would be coloured appropriately so everyone would know which train they are getting on.

I agree if Sheppard was purple and YUS yellow, then it would be hard to explain that some purple trains go south on yellow, while others go north on yellow.

*
Y line (yellow) = (Richmond Hill)-Yonge-University-Vaughan (it actually is sort of Y shaped if you think about it).
B line (green) = Bloor-Danforth-Scarborough (I am assuming this extension gets built).
J line (dark blue?) = Don Mills line (assuming east leg is longer than west, it is J shaped). (could also be a "D" line if Jane is still on the books).
N line (light blue) = Northern Crosstown Sheppard to Vaughan.
C line (purple) = Circular line, Sheppard to Downtown to Finch (it completes a circle with tails).
S line (orange) = Short Y line (Finch to Downtown to Allen-Sheppard).
==My colour scheme save red for TTC surface routes (bus and streetcar).

The good thing is that nobody has figured out what the current line numbers are - so switching to letters is not a big deal.
 
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