[reaperexpress]

It doesn't make sense to build in a choke point like Brampton. Since it would presumably be an express station stop, it would need to be widened for multiple platforms anyway. I took another look at the corridor and it looks like 4 tracks wouldn't be such a difficult fit.

We're not "building in" a choke point. It's already there. The question is whether it's worth fixing at a very high cost. I've been to Brampton Station and it doesn't look like there's room for two more tracks, but if there is we definitely should build them.

The bigger issue is the freights: unlike most of GO's corridors, the line from Silver to Halwest is a major freight route and there's no way that freights could be limited to a night time window. It wouldn't be possible to fit 6 tracks (or at least 5 plus sidings) in the corridor, so something would need to be done. The best long term option would likely be to completely separate the freight bypass from passenger corridors. The most obvious option is the 407 corridor, which is quite spacious through Brampton. The issues would be with grades, though that's hardly insurmountable (pun intended). The route was considered in the high-speed rail studies, but it has far too many curves for that purpose. That's obviously not an issue for freights.

Yes, absolutely. In fact, my original plan included:

- Extending the CN York subdivision west to Milton in order to free up space on the CN/GO Weston subdivision for passenger trains

I was in fact thinking about the 407 corridor. The line would have a lot in common with the Betuweroute in the Netherlands: a new high speed freight line built along the A15 motorway. Hopefully we will be able to avoid some of the controversy and cost overrun they faced because ours would be a much smaller scale project (30km vs 160km; diesel vs electric). Here it is in Google Maps.

With respect to grades, I also agree. The line is going to have to go above or below stuff anyway, so it's going to end up being trenched and elevated regardless of what terrain there is.

 

[gweed123]

We're not "building in" a choke point. It's already there. The question is whether it's worth fixing at a very high cost. I've been to Brampton Station and it doesn't look like there's room for two more tracks, but if there is we definitely should build them.

It is a tight squeeze, but Brampton Station has a pretty big parking lot of the north side, and presumably any GO REX service would involve a pretty significant rebuild of the station anyway. It goes back to 3 tracks on either side of Downtown Brampton. It's only about 1.4km of track where it's 2 and not 3.

Yes, absolutely. In fact, my original plan included:

I was in fact thinking about the 407 corridor. The line would have a lot in common with the Betuweroute in the Netherlands: a new high speed freight line built along the A15 motorway. Hopefully we will be able to avoid some of the controversy and cost overrun they faced because ours would be a much smaller scale project (30km vs 160km; diesel vs electric). Here it is in Google Maps.

Very interesting idea, and one that certainly makes sense. It would actually be a shorter route too, because it wouldn't have to go through Georgetown and then back down through Milton. There would be a couple challenging engineering spots, but it's certainly doable, and would be substantially less costly than widening the Georgetown corridor.

 

[dunkalunk]

Here's the final version of what I've been working on:

 

[borgo100]

What a great Map! What is Speed River Interurban?

 

[DKsan]

What a great Map! What is Speed River Interurban?

I think he meant for it to be a light rail inter-urban line between North Cambridge and Guelph. There's railway I believe that isn't being used which could make it possible.

 

[dunkalunk]

Part is abandoned south of the 401, the rest is relatively unused.

 

[Woodbridge_Heights]

I like the idea of the Brampton-Pickering route, what I call the uptown line, though I prefer the line turn back and terminate at Pearson Airport. But then I have an odd obsession with creating a multi-modal transit stop at the airport and it's surrounding business area, similar but not on the same scale as Union station.

 

[gweed123]

I like the idea of the Brampton-Pickering route, what I call the uptown line, though I prefer the line turn back and terminate at Pearson Airport. But then I have an odd obsession with creating a multi-modal transit stop at the airport and it's surrounding business area, similar but not on the same scale as Union station.

If it's going to come in that way why not have it terminate at Renforth Gateway? IMO that's going to be a more important transit hub than Pearson will be.

 

[Hipster Duck]

That's a really great map, dunkalunk! I have to ask, though, is the Speed River interurban supposed to be a DMU-LRT, similar to the O-train or the NJ transit River line? Do you think there's enough demand for that sort of service between Preston and Guelph?

 

[dunkalunk]

I was thinking Low-Floor DMU as an inaugural service eventually being upgraded to full electric. Whatever vehicle is chosen will need to be compatible with the platforms along the LRT corridor. The seating style would be similar to the River Line's interior as well, being more comfortable for longer travels.

The thinking behind this would be to better integrate Guelph into the Grand River Region and to make Hespeler a much better place to live transit-wise.

 

[unimaginative2]

With one or two Talents trundling back and forth on the line, it might be low-cost enough to be worthwhile. I'm sure the ridership would be as high as several American LRT lines. The O-Train is an amazing model that many more cities, especially mid-size ones, could be following. The whole system was built for $21 million, less than the cost of a kilometre of LRT. That makes it feasible in much smaller markets. It might even work for Kitchener to Cambridge and Kitchener to Guelph as well, to build a kind of interurban triangle. It's not suitable for local urban service in most places, but it's perfectly fine for intercity trips. The Niagara area would be another possible candidate since it has several minimally-used rail corridors.

The big problem with the north mainline as a whole is the section through Guelph. In the area west of the station, the line runs right down the middle of a street lined with houses. There is very little room for adding tracks or separating the right-of-way sufficiently to increase speeds. It will take a large, disruptive capital project but it will need to happen soon. I'm guessing a grade separation will be necessary. There are other notorious slow points on the line that desperately need to be upgraded. Foremost among them is the Grand River bridge.

 

[dunkalunk]

With one or two Talents trundling back and forth on the line, it might be low-cost enough to be worthwhile. I'm sure the ridership would be as high as several American LRT lines. The O-Train is an amazing model that many more cities, especially mid-size ones, could be following. The whole system was built for $21 million, less than the cost of a kilometre of LRT. That makes it feasible in much smaller markets. It might even work for Kitchener to Cambridge and Kitchener to Guelph as well, to build a kind of interurban triangle. It's not suitable for local urban service in most places, but it's perfectly fine for intercity trips. The Niagara area would be another possible candidate since it has several minimally-used rail corridors.

Kitchener to Guelph, yes. Whatever congestion we can take off Highway 7 though hourly/half hourly DMU/EMU service the better.

Kitchener to Cambridge, not so much. There is a paralell highway corridor and LRT line, and the CP corridor is heavily used by North Cambridge manufacturers, in particular Toyota. The LRT line runs pretty much express from Fairview to south Cambridge and for the rest of the corridor, you could easily run regional express bussses on the Conestoga Parkway.

The big problem with the north mainline as a whole is the section through Guelph. In the area west of the station, the line runs right down the middle of a street lined with houses. There is very little room for adding tracks or separating the right-of-way sufficiently to increase speeds. It will take a large, disruptive capital project but it will need to happen soon. I'm guessing a grade separation will be necessary. There are other notorious slow points on the line that desperately need to be upgraded. Foremost among them is the Grand River bridge.

There is no doubt in my mind that there needs to be full grade separation and track straightening through Guelph. I imagine that the entire south side of the street would require demolishing to allow room for a corridor at least 3 tracks wide. Something like this.

I have personally never experienced any significant delays on the Grand River Bridge. Trains appear to go full speed across the Grand (although I do agree that for any frequent service, the bridge will need to be doubled). Perhaps you meant the Speed River Viaduct?

Another problem area on the line is a significant slowdowns on the north mainline is this rail junction. This junction desperately needs to be simplified and/or upgraded to a switch that allows higher speeds for through traffic on the Guelph Sub.

 

[nfitz]

KW map looks very nice.

But I'd rotate much of it 45° so it matches how people are used to seeing KW on a map.

 

[dunkalunk]

That's something that's definitely worth considering if you were printing a full-sized foldable map, but this format would lend nicely to backlit maps in one of the two ad spaces of transit shelters and could be used just as much for information as self-advertising of the network.

 

[nfitz]

Not sure how the orientation would relate to how it was used. I wasn't suggesting changing the dimensions, just some of the road orientations.

For example, people in expect E-W roads like Columbia to look more E-W rather than NW-SE. The road is more SW-NE than NW-SE, so will naturally confuse people, no matter where they are looking at the map.