[ehlow]

TGM has it wrong, 1/2 the trains will turn back at Laird, not Don Mills.

frequencies will likely not be 90 seconds on opening day, as that is way more than needed. We will either see 2 car trains running every 2 minutes in the tunnel and every 4 minutes outside of it, or 3 car trains running every 3 minutes in the tunnel and every 6 minutes on the surface. Judging by renderings released by Metrolinx, they are thinking of option 1 currently, but nobody really knows. People keep mentioning 90 seconds in the tunnel and 3 minutes on the surface as that is what the line will be capable of should demand require it, though initial demand likely won't.

Those frequencies seem more reasonable. Thanks for the info.

 

[Johnny Au]

The Eglinton Crosstown LRT would also make it easier for those who live on the east end to go to Sunnybrook (or CNIB, Bloorview, or Toronto Rehab).

 

[TheTigerMaster]

TGM has it wrong, 1/2 the trains will turn back at Laird, not Don Mills.

frequencies will likely not be 90 seconds on opening day, as that is way more than needed. We will either see 2 car trains running every 2 minutes in the tunnel and every 4 minutes outside of it, or 3 car trains running every 3 minutes in the tunnel and every 6 minutes on the surface. Judging by renderings released by Metrolinx, they are thinking of option 1 currently, but nobody really knows. People keep mentioning 90 seconds in the tunnel and 3 minutes on the surface as that is what the line will be capable of should demand require it, though initial demand likely won't.

Thats not entirely correct. Two minute frequencies with 2 car trainsets or three minute frequencies with 3 car trainsets is far too infrequent to accommodate ridership in the underground portion. Judging from ML report we will at the very least have 2 minute frequencies with 3 car trainsets, which can move about 14,500 people,(forecasted ridership is 12,000). The TTC could make this more more frequent to reduce crowding.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

Yup, many people work & live near Eglinton . Yonge & Eglinton has many offices. It can also be used as part of another trip, for example, maybe you live in Leaside and want to go to York U, you could take Eglinton across, then the Spadina subway up. Or you live in Liberty Village and work at Yonge & Eglinton, you could take the Dufferin bus north to Eglinton, then Eglinton across. Imagine the possibilities!

The current buses, as slow as they are, already carry 48,000 per day on the West, 29,000 East of Yonge. So the West part alone carries more than the Scarborough RT and as much as the Sheppard subway on buses.

http://www.ttc.ca/About_the_TTC/Transit_Planning/Surface_Ridership_2012.jsp

190 Scarborough Rocket had 10,000 riders. That does not bode well at all for any person trying to say Sheppard should be extended. Eglinton West Ridership is High! I can't believe McGuinty cut eglinton west. smh!

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

Hmm.. 20k pphpd (90 second frequencies, 300 foot long trains similar to Eglinton, near crush loads).

Now, that gives you 40k people per hour in the peak point. If there was a full on rush for 12 hours, you can hit a half million though a single point in the network.

If you spread it out between 3 transfer stations (Eglinton West, Eglinton, Eglinton East to DRL), and each achieves 12k pphpd, that's well under crush for Eglinton at any given point, to each of those transfer stations (24k pph per station or 72k pph on the line at any time; all transferring to the nearest north/south lines); then it's conceivable to hit 500k on Eglinton LRT in a standard 2.5 hour morning (180k: 60k to Spadina, 60k to Yonge, 60k to DRL) and evening rush hour (180k) plus moderate off-peak service (140k).

The secret to high numbers is very high churn of the customer. If you convinced 2000 people at each station to ride Yonge subway for a single station only then the line as a whole might hit 140k passengers per hour and be in the low millions of riders per day.

Eglinton, unlike Yonge, doesn't actually go anywhere. The only purpose it serves is to bring someone to the nearest subway transfer point which should give the line unusually high churn.

10,000 PPHD x 24 x 2(for each direction)

thats just for surface LRT. now obviously due to fluctuating usage patterns that number isn't achievable, but Jane would regardless be very, very far from capacity.

Thanks very much!

 

[ehlow]

190 Scarborough Rocket had 10,000 riders. That does not bode well at all for any person trying to say Sheppard should be extended. Eglinton West Ridership is High! I can't believe McGuinty cut eglinton west. smh!

Well 85 Sheppard East has 27,100. Maybe people use the local route more than the express route because they start their trip closer to a local stop?

Also, you meant Mike Harris as the one who cancelled the Eglinton West subway right?

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

Well 85 Sheppard East has 27,100. Maybe people use the local route more than the express route because they start their trip closer to a local stop?

Also, you meant Mike Harris as the one who cancelled the Eglinton West subway right?

No, in 2010, the Liberal government cut transit city in half. Eglinton was cut back to weston road.

But yes you are right about sheppard. I don't think the combined ridership put's it in distance of a subway still.

 

[innsertnamehere]

Thats not entirely correct. Two minute frequencies with 2 car trainsets or three minute frequencies with 3 car trainsets is far too infrequent to accommodate ridership in the underground portion. Judging from ML report we will at the very least have 2 minute frequencies with 3 car trainsets, which can move about 14,500 people,(forecasted ridership is 12,000). The TTC could make this more more frequent to reduce crowding.

forecasted ridership is 5,900. the 12,000 figure came from when the SRT was still planned to be thru-run with Eglinton.

 

[ehlow]

No, in 2010, the Liberal government cut transit city in half.

But yes you are right about sheppard. I don't think the combined ridership put's it in distance of a subway still.

Oh I see. Well nothing prevents it from being built later . I think phase 1 of Eglinton at 20km is already a pretty long line to become operational at once, and certainly long enough to be very useful.

I wonder if the fact that the local Sheppard bus has much more ridership than the express version makes the case that people prefer closer stop spacing at the expense of speed?

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

Oh I see. Well nothing prevents it from being built later . I think phase 1 of Eglinton at 20km is already a pretty long line to become operational at once, and certainly long enough to be very useful.

I wonder if the fact that the local Sheppard bus has much more ridership than the express version makes the case that people prefer closer stop spacing at the expense of speed?

Definately. Which means the LRT is a better fit.

 

[WislaHD]

If the Sheppard line was converted to LRT do you guys think there should be a station at Willowdale?

 

[TheTigerMaster]

If the Sheppard line was converted to LRT do you guys think there should be a station at Willowdale?

Can't think of any reasons why there shouldn't be.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

If the Sheppard line was converted to LRT do you guys think there should be a station at Willowdale?

Yes.

 

[BurlOak]

Yes.

SHOULD be a station - answer YES.
WOULD be a station - answer NO.

The cost of an underground LRT station is the same as a subway station, so the technology has no effect on the station.

My guess is that there are a lot of renters in the area staying in those small war-era housing (the ones not yet converted to Monster Homes). They must have opposed the Willowdale station because it would have led to more development, which would invariably lead to them loosing their choice location close to Yonge and downtown North York.

 

[rbt]

What matters is how crowded it is from 8-9am on weekdays. Obviously during off peak it will be below capacity but that is irrelevant. If the Eglinton LRT is actually carrying 10000/hour, it will be like the Yonge line south of Bloor which is unacceptable.

Eglinton crush is around 750 people per 3-car train isn't it? 255 people per car according to Bombardier.

10,000 pphpd people spread evenly across 40 trains per hour (90 second headways) is a very roomy 250 people per train. That's almost exactly 1/3rd of peak capacity in the tunnel sections.

Yonge is closer to 95% capacity during peak between Bloor and Wellesley.

It will be easier for Eglinton to reliably hit 90 second frequencies due to using shorter trains than for Yonge to hit 90 second frequencies.