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The thing I'm most impressed by with the new artic buses is the interior lighting. So much brighter inside than the non-artics, makes a big difference at night and in the winter.
 
the lemur said:
The thing I'm most impressed by with the new artic buses is the interior lighting. So much brighter inside than the non-artics, makes a big difference at night and in the winter.
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Do you find there's any difference in terms of how crowded it is? Or any differences with frequency or reliability?
 
ehlow said:
Do you find there's any difference in terms of how crowded it is? Or any differences with frequency or reliability?
Click to expand...

The frequency is about the same as it was before they were introduced; I've yet to experience the same kind of crowding as before. I should point out that I don't take the 7 regularly, but I'll grab it if it happens to show up at the stop near my house or if it's there at Bathurst when I get off the subway. I walk more often than I take it.
 
W. K. Lis said:
Buses and streetcars are usually washed before they go out in the morning, unless there is a malfunction. Since they are out on the road most of the day, they will get covered with dirt, slush, and spray as the day goes on. Maybe the rain today will wash some of the accumulated dirt off.
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I've been wondering for a while why the buses are so dirty in the winter compared to the streetcar, even on slow downtown routes. I assume most of the splatter is from other vehicles, and yet it's always so shocking being on a bus, instead of a streetcar, in the winter, with it often so heavy that you can't see out the window - which I've never experienced on a streetcar.
 
the lemur said:
The frequency is about the same as it was before they were introduced; I've yet to experience the same kind of crowding as before.
Click to expand...
It is currently, but part of the justification is how much money they'd be saving with less operators. Presumably once a route is fully converted to Artics they will reduce the frequency.

But how much? If you look at the 2014 TTC Crowding Standards you'll see that the peak standard for 36-seaters they currently use on 7 Bathurst is 51 people compared to 77 on the Nova artic.

If they apply these standards, presumably the AM Peak service would drop from 19 to 13 buses. This would change the frequency from once every 6.3 minutes to once every 9.2 minutes.

For PM Peak service would drop from 22 to 15 buses, changing the frequency from once every 5.5 minutes to once every 8.1 minutes.
 
nfitz said:
I've been wondering for a while why the buses are so dirty in the winter compared to the streetcar, even on slow downtown routes. I assume most of the splatter is from other vehicles, and yet it's always so shocking being on a bus, instead of a streetcar, in the winter, with it often so heavy that you can't see out the window - which I've never experienced on a streetcar.
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It's really bad on the low-floor buses - something about them that gets the winter gunk all over the windows in no time. Better wheel wells should fix this. The high-floor Orion Vs and the Nova RTS buses don't become translucent boxes like the VIIs do.
 
ShonTron said:
It's really bad on the low-floor buses - something about them that gets the winter gunk all over the windows in no time. Better wheel wells should fix this. The high-floor Orion Vs and the Nova RTS buses don't become translucent boxes like the VIIs do.
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So the gunk is coming off the buses itself?

I wouldn't think the low-flow versus high floor would be an issue otherwise.

Now that you mention it, I don't recall as much guck so often in my previous life as a commuter in Montreal on GM Classics (or whatever they were) 30 years ago ...
 
nfitz said:
It is currently, but part of the justification is how much money they'd be saving with less operators. Presumably once a route is fully converted to Artics they will reduce the frequency.

But how much? If you look at the 2014 TTC Crowding Standards you'll see that the peak standard for 36-seaters they currently use on 7 Bathurst is 51 people compared to 77 on the Nova artic.

If they apply these standards, presumably the AM Peak service would drop from 19 to 13 buses. This would change the frequency from once every 6.3 minutes to once every 9.2 minutes.

For PM Peak service would drop from 22 to 15 buses, changing the frequency from once every 5.5 minutes to once every 8.1 minutes.
Click to expand...

That's exactly what is happening - 13 buses in the morning peak and 15 in the afternoon.

Dan
Toronto, Ont.
 
That's quite a frequency drop. I wish they were replacing the non-articulated routes almost 1 to 1 on routes where there isn't enough capacity.

Hopefully they're at least getting more reliable.
 
ehlow said:
That's quite a frequency drop. I wish they were replacing the non-articulated routes almost 1 to 1 on routes where there isn't enough capacity.

Hopefully they're at least getting more reliable.
Click to expand...

Ha ha ha!

The Bathurst route is horribly mismanaged with terrible bunching, overcrowding, short-turns and long waits at Bathurst Station. Doing a straight capacity swap will be a disaster, especially without better line management.
 
I'd argue the TTC has more capacity on just about all its routes without adding 1 bus ... simply with much better route management ... which as you say, is terrible on most routes.
 
ShonTron said:
Ha ha ha!

The Bathurst route is horribly mismanaged with terrible bunching, overcrowding, short-turns and long waits at Bathurst Station. Doing a straight capacity swap will be a disaster, especially without better line management.
Click to expand...

I didn't realize my suggestion of replacing each non-articulated bus with an articulated one was so ridiculous... Is it the issue that dwell times per stop would increase due to each vehicle carrying more people? Are you saying decreased frequencies will help them manage better? Or are you saying it's irrelevant whether you use articulated or not since it's badly managed anyways?

Thanks for enlightening me :)
 
So are they planning on all-door boarding? I haven't been following... I don't see how replacing buses with artics and reducing frequencies will improve reliability. Seems like reliability would only get worse...

If no all-door boarding, they'd have to add more layover times for buses to catch up to the schedule. Of course, that means lower frequency (and capacity) or adding more buses.
 
I use the 7 daily to go to Bathurst Station, and I find the route is actually worse with the new buses. I am lucky enough to live right on Bathurst, so I have the option of walking to St. Clair West station, but many others do not.
I like the new buses, but the route frequency is worse, IMO.
 
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