[Bamako]

I don't think it is a good idea. There is no R.O.W. available between Jane and Kipling. It will have to run in mixed traffic half of the way, will take about an hour to get from Yonge to Kipling, and the reliability of the St Clair R.O.W. section will suffer.

The 512 route Yonge to Kipling will not be able to play a crosstown role because of its low speed. I do not think a lot of riders use 501 streetcar to travel across the town.

However, extending 512 just to Jane makes sense, as it would improve the connectivity and simplify the bus network in the area.

I looked on Google Earth and it looks like there's plenty of room to stick in a ROW along Dundas. It's also a straight connection between ECC and Midtown (I have no idea how many people make this commute though)

 

[Rainforest]

I looked on Google Earth and it looks like there's plenty of room to stick in a ROW along Dundas. It's also a straight connection between ECC and Midtown (I have no idea how many people make this commute though)

Not everywhere along Dundas. I use map.toronto.ca; when you enlarge it enough, you can check-mark property lines and actual buildings.

At some points between the Humber River and Royal York, the gap between the buildings on the opposite sides is only 24 - 26 m. West of Islington, it is even worse in some spots, 22 - 24 m.

The optimal width for Transit City LRT streets is 36 m; that allows 2 transit lanes, 4 general traffic lanes, wide sidewalks, and bike lanes. I guess something can be compromised. But if you have less than 28 - 30 m, building a streetcar ROW will be challenging.

 

[Rainforest]

I would like the 512 loop at Jane, Dundas, Scarlett Road, and back onto St. Clair. However, they first would have to actually rebuild the railway underpass at Scarlett and Dundas. The environmental assessment was completed in 2004, and I'm still waiting for the first measurements to start.

This is a possibility.

 

[CDL.TO]

I'd like to see them extend it to Jane and have the TTC build a bus terminal at Jane at St. Clair. With some minor diversions, it could serve routes 512, 35 Jane, 79 Scarlett, 40 Junction, 30 Lambton, 55 Warren Park, and potentially 71 Runnymede. Also, once the GO Milton line gets electrified and upgraded to more of a REX/S-Bahn service, you could add a station there.

It would provide a great hub and improve transit connections in that part of town which right now are quite poor.

 

[W. K. Lis]

According to the 2013-2022 Capital Program, the St. Clair West/Metrolinx Grade Separation might (MIGHT!) occur 2015 to 2018. So don't expect any extension until after 2018, and hopefully with a more transit friendly mayor as well.

In the meantime, construction of the new underpass at St. Clair/Scarlett/Dundas is supposed to be started this year until 2015. Haven't seen any action there yet.

 

[Woodbridge_Heights]

I'd like to see them extend it to Jane and have the TTC build a bus terminal at Jane at St. Clair. With some minor diversions, it could serve routes 512, 35 Jane, 79 Scarlett, 40 Junction, 30 Lambton, 55 Warren Park, and potentially 71 Runnymede. Also, once the GO Milton line gets electrified and upgraded to more of a REX/S-Bahn service, you could add a station there.

It would provide a great hub and improve transit connections in that part of town which right now are quite poor.

I agree. I've always thought the area had the potential to become a little hub of it's own. Even extending the Dundas streetcar to the area would help. Especially now, given that there's been some commercial development along Dundas.

 

[drum118]

The only place you can have an ROW on Dundas is from Bloor to Dupont, Runnymede to Islington, Kipling to Dundas Ontario.

You try to put one between Dupont and Runnymede, those people will go nuts loosing their on street parking.

As for the bridge, you can punch holes on either side of the structure for new sidewalks, but will do nothing for traffic. You get a bike lane. Even then you have a major issue with those townhouse for the north sidewalk.

Those townhouse are going to bit the city more than it was worth putting them in there in the first place.

To get 4 lanes of traffic and the ROW under a new overpass, you are going to have to buy land to the south and shift the road to the south even if you built a retaining wall in front of those house. The residents will have to use the back door during the construction.

The removal of the centre pier support is not going to do much in get getting more room along with the existing sidewalk for more traffic lanes.

In the end, any new bridge will not get started until 2016 at the earliest and will require shifting CP over onto the Georgetown line as well taking a track or 2 out of service on that line to built the east section of the new bridge. Then you will have to shift the Georgetown service over onto the CP section to build the west section.

There is less than 10 feet between the bridge and the property line to the south. Since you are going to need 22+ feet more for the new lanes and wider sidewalk, let alone the thought of bike lanes, the city will have to buy up land west of the bridge including buildings to get this new overpass built.

I proposed years ago that holes be punch on either side of the structure for new bike and sidewalk and the removal of the existing sidewalk for better traffic use.

I did also proposed that St Clair along with Lawrence Ave become the overpass with rail running under it, but CP opposed the thought of having their line in the trench even if the grade was .7%.

Even if the surface overpass was built, the city would still need to buy land to have 4 lanes of traffic in this area.

As for taking 512 west to either Jane or Dundas is a long ways off until we get a mayor and council that understand this is the way to go. The EA is ready to go for the extension. Then the major issue will have to take place and that is buying up property not under city control for this expansion and will cost way more now than doing years ago.

In fact, the EA was original plan to go out in 2012 until Ford came to power. The EA was not to surface for 2 years until after the the full ROW went into service. June 2010 was the start date of the 2 year time frame.

Personnel, the extension needs to go to Dundas as the next phase.

TTC wants to reinstall the tracks on Dundas to cut down on the deadheading of the 512 and provide better service in this area. Since all the existing tracks have been removed, TTC will have to do a full New EA for putting the track back in. If there was still track there, then no EA would be require to rebuilt the line.

 

[Memph]

Not everywhere along Dundas. I use map.toronto.ca; when you enlarge it enough, you can check-mark property lines and actual buildings.

At some points between the Humber River and Royal York, the gap between the buildings on the opposite sides is only 24 - 26 m. West of Islington, it is even worse in some spots, 22 - 24 m.

The optimal width for Transit City LRT streets is 36 m; that allows 2 transit lanes, 4 general traffic lanes, wide sidewalks, and bike lanes. I guess something can be compromised. But if you have less than 28 - 30 m, building a streetcar ROW will be challenging.

That sounds like enough room for LRT, just not enough for LRT without reduce automobile capacity. 22-24m should be easily wide enough for an LRT ROW, 2 sharrows for bikes and cars and sidewalks, no? If you're going to trade automobile capacity for other modes though, it probably makes more sense to do so on King/Queen, Richmond/Adelaide or Yonge (pedestrians) for now, there will probably be too much opposition and too few benefits in this area.

 

[Rainforest]

That sounds like enough room for LRT, just not enough for LRT without reduce automobile capacity. 22-24m should be easily wide enough for an LRT ROW, 2 sharrows for bikes and cars and sidewalks, no? If you're going to trade automobile capacity for other modes though, it probably makes more sense to do so on King/Queen, Richmond/Adelaide or Yonge (pedestrians) for now, there will probably be too much opposition and too few benefits in this area.

King and/or Queen certainly makes sense. I guess the main issue there is not the loss of auto capacity - which is pretty low anyway - but rather the parking spaces and the shops / restaurants that depend on parking spaces.

Speaking of Dundas (the Junction section, not downtown), technically it may be possible to lay it out with room for streetcar lanes. Maybe, 2 dedicated streetcar lanes, plus two wide auto lanes that allow moving cars to bypass parked cars, plus sidewalks and some trees. However, this route is hardly a priority for the city. Even the majority of transit riders in the area are likely more interested in getting to Bloor subway as quickly as possible, rather than traveling all the way to Yonge on a streetcar. If Dundas Junction streetcar tracks are built, the riders might ask to run their route to Dundas West Stn, and keep 512 St Clair a separate route.

 

[car4041]

Even the majority of transit riders in the area are likely more interested in getting to Bloor subway as quickly as possible, rather than traveling all the way to Yonge on a streetcar. If Dundas Junction streetcar tracks are built, the riders might ask to run their route to Dundas West Stn, and keep 512 St Clair a separate route.

I'm not sure what you mean here. Of course Dundas Junction streetcar tracks would go to Dundas West station -- how could they not? I've always understood this idea basically as extending the 512 St. Clair car to Runnymede or Jane and replacing the 40 Junction bus with a streetcar. The only time the 512 St. Clair would run on Dundas would be entering and leaving service, as a shorter alternative to the current Bathurst route.

 

[drum118]

This is what St Clair looks like at the bridge.

You see it lack space for making it 6 lanes at Keele without doing what I say in my last posting.

Current shots

 

[W. K. Lis]

This is what St Clair looks like at the bridge.

You see it lack space for making it 6 lanes at Keele without doing what I say in my last posting.

Current shots

There's a autobody/auto repair shop (blue building) at the northeast corner of Keele & St. Clair. On the other side, there's a Delta Bingo with a wide empty space in front (that's the empty space to the right of the streetcar). Seems there's space available to me. They no need to touch the townhouses nor the tall building on the northeast corner of Old Weston & St. Clair.

 

[the lemur]

There's a autobody/auto repair shop (blue building) at the northeast corner of Keele & St. Clair. On the other side, there's a Delta Bingo with a wide empty space in front (that's the empty space to the right of the streetcar). Seems there's space available to me. They no need to touch the townhouses nor the tall building on the northeast corner of Old Weston & St. Clair.

That's what I was thinking too.

 

[Neil]

-or- if you don't mind digging some dirt, lower the rail corridor similar to Strachan and return St. Clair to a level street.

 

[junctionist]

There is indeed enough space on both sides, except for the auto repair shop--an small, cheap and expendable building. It's a little tricky at Old Weston Road with the historic Heydon House on the northwest corner, but the roadway could shift slightly to the south. Alternately, an additional lane could be built where the existing sidewalk is (up to almost the facade of the building), with an arcade built through the Heydon House for pedestrians. The arcade would open up onto the sidewalk continuing west of the building.