1875
Senior Member
downtown seems like such an unattractive place to live vs the beltline, kensington, inglewood, bridgeland, east village etc. guess if they build enough residential it could change but that seems like a long way off.
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- Thread starter Surrealplaces
- Start date
Spring2008
Active Member
Beltline will definitely be the main draw moving forward. There's a lot of residential development starting on the north and west edges of the CBD, but I don’t think those areas will turn into anything special - probably just some small neighborhood retail and restaurants added as the residential increases. I can see the south side of the CBD near Stephen Ave, The Core Mall, and the LRT, becoming a big residential draw with office conversions, plus there’s space for some new residential towers. That area could be like an extension of the Beltline, especially with so many amenities already nearby, and Stephen Ave could even extend west with those conversions. Wasn’t there also a tower proposal for Olympic Plaza? Also, yes why has that lot south of the Bow stayed vacant so long?
FCC1982
Senior Member
I agree - as a kid who loved (and still loves) skyscrapers I remember how excited I was when the project appeared on the front page of the Herald. I have been lamenting that the 64 storey tower never got built since it was capped at ground level (hence my member name and avatar
).I’m cautiously hopeful that Aimco is serious about building something tall here although I doubt I will like the design as much as the SOM designed FCC from the 80s.
KensingtonLurker
New Member
I get what you are saying, but it really isn't that long ago that Bridgeland and East Village were not attractive places to live. Both of them have been a while in getting going, but they also both required a bunch of new infrastructure, while DT could probably add 10 000 units tomorrow with relatively little new infrastructure. There are already a decent amount of amenities downtown that Bridge land and EV didn't have when they got started. DT residents would rely on EV or Beltline for groceries (Superstore & Safeway), but realistically that isn't a big concern anymore....I live in West Hillhurst and get probably 75% of my groceries delivered now because it's only about $15 and I don't need to take an hour out of my day to do it.
Mountain Man
Senior Member
Only way to fix that is to add residents... These conversions are a massive step up and exactly what downtown needs.
CBBarnett
Senior Member
Beltline will remain the best location for high-density living in all likelihood, as it also continues to improve and grow in parallel to downtown.
But I could totally see apartment towers right in the commercial core like this FCC 2 location as being an attractive option. It's "big city" transit accessible with a capital "T", right on 2 high-frequency rapid transit lines and countless bus routes.. Big mall, shops and stuff to do on Stephen Ave. 4 blocks to Chinatown. 4 blocks to Beltline. Plus 15 access to all sorts of stuff. It's actually in a location that isn't a car sewer in downtown, traffic outside of rush is nothing. It's not just pedestrian friendly, it's almost pedestrian prioritized in this exact area.
I could go on but it's kind of obvious. Living in the physical centre of everything might not be for everyone, but I think you probably won't have a problem renting out 1,000 apartments in this location indefinitely.
Edit: just for fun, here's the nearest superstore by transit time - 5 minutes. We give Calgary Transit a hard time sometimes, but 3 minutes frequency in a free-fare zone? Legitimately impressive. That's about as good as transit can get - like anywhere, in any city. Apart from a grocery store in the podium of your apartment or within a block on foot, I don't know how you could improve your grocery access.
But I could totally see apartment towers right in the commercial core like this FCC 2 location as being an attractive option. It's "big city" transit accessible with a capital "T", right on 2 high-frequency rapid transit lines and countless bus routes.. Big mall, shops and stuff to do on Stephen Ave. 4 blocks to Chinatown. 4 blocks to Beltline. Plus 15 access to all sorts of stuff. It's actually in a location that isn't a car sewer in downtown, traffic outside of rush is nothing. It's not just pedestrian friendly, it's almost pedestrian prioritized in this exact area.
I could go on but it's kind of obvious. Living in the physical centre of everything might not be for everyone, but I think you probably won't have a problem renting out 1,000 apartments in this location indefinitely.
Edit: just for fun, here's the nearest superstore by transit time - 5 minutes. We give Calgary Transit a hard time sometimes, but 3 minutes frequency in a free-fare zone? Legitimately impressive. That's about as good as transit can get - like anywhere, in any city. Apart from a grocery store in the podium of your apartment or within a block on foot, I don't know how you could improve your grocery access.
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maestro
Senior Member
I just can't see them building a 65 storey tower. This is just a flip betting on an office boom. They could buy several more major office towers for the cost to build a 65 storey tower.
trtcttc
Senior Member
I doubt anyone is betting on an office boom, that'd be a pretty terrible strategy considering offices are down significantly all over North America. Calgary had some recovery years from the oil collapse and that's only brought us marginally down to 29% vacancy with essentially no new build coming to market. Not sure what catalyst could possibly lead to an office boom.
DougB
Senior Member
The commercial real estate collapse hit Calgary well before other cities. The recent surge in transaction is likely a sign that valuations have bottomed out. Other cities have yet to test the bottom.
Urban_Views
New Member
With the end of the Eau Claire market as the downtown "food hall/ public market", I think the Mewata Armoury should be eyed as the next spot.
Pros:
I'd love to hear if anyone knows of this site changing hands in the near future or if there are other plans for it. Could you not consolidate the Military recruiting services to the 17th military site, the military museum, or the Currie Barracks location?
Pros:
- Nearby transit station
- Creation of a new destination on the west end
- There is no food hall space similar to the Granville Island Public Market, St. Lawrence Market or even the Saint John City Market in the downtown area. These are markets where locals and tourists spend money.
- The building has a unique style and appears to have a lofted interior area with natural light.
- Possible integration with Cowboys Park.
- Federally Owned
- On-site parking?
I'd love to hear if anyone knows of this site changing hands in the near future or if there are other plans for it. Could you not consolidate the Military recruiting services to the 17th military site, the military museum, or the Currie Barracks location?
darwink
Senior Member
CF looked into this in recent memory. The members who serve there overwhelmingly wished for the location to stay put. There are now some auxiliary facilities in the NE where vehicles and equipment are stored.
CalgaryTiger
Senior Member
Calgary's Inglewood community to see new affordable housing units
A new affordable housing complex is coming to Calgary’s Inglewood community. After a two-year wait, a re-zoning proposal for the property in an industrial area known as the ‘Brewery Rail Lands’ has been granted. The property along 17 Avenue SE has been owned by the Calgary Drop-In Centre (DI)...
calgary.citynews.ca
New affordable housing in Inglewoood, I use to live across the park from here. Very quiet for being centralized. The NIMBY in the reporter's video is hilarious: Assumes it will be a drop-in centre, says he's moving, reporter corrects him, still says he's moving.
They call it 'Brewery Rail Lands', I assume they'll be building a new structure but they could convert the building just not sure how you would do it.
It is here:
maestro
Senior Member
Boom was the wrong choice of word. The purchase prices are so heavily devalued For FCC and BVS that a modest recovery with vacancies dropping to the mid to high teens would positively affect valuation. Armoyan is the majority stakeholder in Slate which is teetering on insolvency so he needs a recovery in commercial property valuations in any case.
This real estate investment fund buys low and sells high. They make minimal improvements to increase property values. They don't develop and they have never built anything as big and costly as a 65 storey tower. They will seek approval from the federal housing initiatives if there is any seriousness.
trtcttc
Senior Member
How high was vacancies in BVS and FCC? They took their leasing sites down after they got bought. Without making improvements, wouldn't it be hard to see leasing increase, considering many other buildings are starting renovations.
Calgcouver
Senior Member
I don't think I see a world where another office tower is built, likely for another few decades that isn't medical office like the one across from the new Cancer Centre.
That is a ton of office space and there is just so much AA and A space I just don't see why anyone would build until these numbers are at least half of what they are today. Even Suncor looking at that Stephen Avenue Quarter site decided to negotiate to stay put and renovate.
I think we'll be in a world where office to residential or hotel conversions and residential development will be the driver's of development downtown for at least another decade to come, if not longer. Doubtful we will see very tall development happening in these cycles, I think what we'll see is a lot of under-utilized lots (surface parking lots, primarily) filled in with residential development of modest heights, similarly to what happened in Downtown, False Creek/Yaletown , Coal Harbour through 1990-2015.
We'll be a much better City in that residential-heavy development model anyways, so I could care less if they build another office tower ever again haha. And even if they do new office so that people can newer or more differentiated spaces, I hope they are mid-rise and Mass Timber like this:
That way new office isn't over-delivered in a single huge building and the AAA office could have differentiated spaces from what's currently available. Would be a better model of delivering new office space that is more responsive and sensitive to market conditions, without drastically oversupplying office as we've done in the past.
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