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Fair enough.

I certainly didn't find him "slick". He came across as quite sincere, albeit professional, to me.

You're suggesting that Rathika was more personable. I disagree. What about her interaction with you, gave you that impression? I'm genuinely curious.

I did not say more personable--and I've had no interaction w/her; but in the end, that's immaterial. The thing is: for her to win like she did in a seat w/little or no discernable NDP history, there has to be something beyond mere Tamil-based machine politics to explain things. Look: she worked hard, did the riding top to bottom, got her signs out pronto even before Jack-mania. And from whatever I can tell through the media, she *was* young/likeable, in that '06 Dave Meslin "City Idol" way. As an exemplar of triumphant NDP celebratory-campaigning idealism, I suppose I could call her the Andrew Cash to Rana Sarkar's Mario Silva--and I suppose if you lived in Davenport, you'd find Cash as offputtingly beholden to lefty urban elites as you find Rathika beholden to Tamil voting blocs. You know: your mileage may vary...
 
From Three thoughts about Ruth Ellen Brosseau in today's Globe and Mail:

First, after an initial look there appears to be no truth to the claim – advanced by her bitter, mean-spirited, defeated political opponents – that she falsified her nomination papers. Those papers are publicly available. The required signatures were obtained through a door-to-door canvass conducted for her by her party. The two signatures in question are in sequential order with neighbours on either side who also signed, to help this young female candidate out. It is therefore not clear whether something has happened here to reflect discredit on Ms. Brosseau, or (ultimately) on her angry and humiliated Liberal opponent.
 
To people painting her as personable, I'd like to know on what basis you are forming that judgement. I interacted with all three major party candidates. And though, I didn't vote for him, I found the Liberal candidate the most polished and personable.

Adma and Jeff, did you interact with Rathika? And did you meet the other two?

Regarding Rathika, I don't think I've painted her as personable, or anything for that matter. I met Rana briefly and saw Gallyot speak. I would say Rana was slick - and that's not necessarily a negative, particularly considering his business chairperson background. Very very polished. In my instance, Gallyot was all talking points and nothing more. I saw Rathika speak at an event - she was good with the crowd but really didn't say much of substance, in my instance. But those are just my quick interactions. I'm not trying to make a case for/against any of the candidates - never have. My point in this discussion is and has always been about the "she only won because ____" argument, regardless of who won/lost.

I hope you don't think I was picking on you in all of this - that was never the intent. I've just been involved in a number of campaigns for multipel parties. In my experience the "they only won because of <<whatever>>" is always the loser's mantra. And it can be mined down so far that it gets ridiculous - three campaigns ago I was part of a losing effort and one of our supporters mentioned to me that the winner had "only won because of their party's policies." Well, yeah, ok no duh. What's bad about that?

But worse, and I'm <i>not</i> sugegsting that you are doing this, but it can be a really nasty way of making discrimination sound a-ok.

I worked a campaign many years ago where we were running a very whitebread candidate in what could be considered a very 'ethnic' riding. And our campaign (not me - and I'm wasn't proud of it thenor now) always asserted (in private) the opponent "only gets votes because he's one of them."

But really, it was more than that. He was able to pinpoint local problems due to his invovlement in the local community. He spoke an additional language so he could communciate with thousands of people who were previously unengaged. He addressed social and employment issues that were relevant to the everday lives of people like him, and his party supported policies that had an appeal to many in his ;ethnic community' (amongst others). He could better appreciate the everyday issues of those voters and therefore translated big P policy issues to the everday lives of constituents of his in a way that our candidate could not. He was getting people out to vote - people who had never before voted.

That's why and what he ended up being elected to do - with a margin that took more than just 'ethnic' voters to achieve. (And, funnily enough, two elections later the party I had worked for won the riding, defeating a candidate of that same 'ethnicity' that had won previously for our opponents. Hmmmm....)

Similarly, I worked where the whisper campaign was always "the MP only works for the Indians." For 40 years, the local MPs didn't give a fig; they never visited, they didn't address Native issues, and those people went unrepresented. And then someone gets elected who takes the same interest in them as all of the constituents in their riding.

And then it becomes "well, the MP only cares about the Indians". Sure...the 'Native' turnout is low, the political establishment in many of the Native communities was not supportive of the national party, the vote was shared amongst two parties and the (now former) MP regularly won with 50 percent plus (where the Native population was only about 15 percent the riding's population, and half of that 15 were kids under 20). And then, when the MP brought up a 'Native' issue, the response was always "see, I <i>told</i> you so..."

Assertions like those are used simply because they're easy to spread, they're unprovable, unaddressable and cover up the losing party's failings without any serious introspection necessary on their part.
 
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"Debt extended between 1985 and 1994 after 9 years of Mulroney/Tory rule, total: $300 billion, absolutely asinine for what Mulroney didn't accomplish and for the massive recession his government presided over at the end of his term."

Yes debt did skyrocket 300 billion dollars under Mulroney. However you have to remember that Mulroney was actually balancing or coming close to balancing Canada's operating budget. 300 billion dollars is almost exactly what it cost Mulroney's government to pay the interest on Trudeau's debts, If Trudeau hadn't started accumulating debt that Mulroney had to service it is highly likely that Canada's debt would not have increased under Mulroney. It took Mulroney, Chretien and Martin to fix most of the damage Trudeau did. From annoying Quebec by repatriating the Constitution without their signature, to annoying the west with the NEP, to spending a fortune and establishing a tradition of deficit, Trudeau has a lot to answer for.
 
The Liberal are just another right wing party, just not as far right as the conservative party. In other words, why look at them as having any difference?

NDP! It's the only alternative. The liberals campaign on the left sometimes, only to take away NDP votes. I hope they enjoy being underrepresented in parliament now.
 
The Liberal are just another right wing party, just not as far right as the conservative party. In other words, why look at them as having any difference?

NDP! It's the only alternative. The liberals campaign on the left sometimes, only to take away NDP votes. I hope they enjoy being underrepresented in parliament now.

If NDP rules, Canada will be pretty much over. NDP is so out of touch with reality that they should move to an isolated island and start building their own utopia. Wait, nobody who actually is working and making money will go with them!
 
If NDP rules, Canada will be pretty much over. NDP is so out of touch with reality that they should move to an isolated island and start building their own utopia. Wait, nobody who actually is working and making money will go with them!

Maybe you should leave Canada? You would fit in perfectly with Michele Bachmann and her tea baggers ;)

teabagger_signs_912_0cee6.JPG
 
If NDP rules, Canada will be pretty much over. NDP is so out of touch with reality that they should move to an isolated island and start building their own utopia. Wait, nobody who actually is working and making money will go with them!

For the NDP to rule, it will have to entice a lot of pragmatic, mushy middle liberal types. Does anyone see this happening ?
 
Maybe you should leave Canada? You would fit in perfectly with Michele Bachmann and her tea baggers ;)

teabagger_signs_912_0cee6.JPG

What are you talking about. Canada is under Harper's majority government, which I think is doing all the right things to make Canada a better and more compeitive country.

If NDP does come into power, I will seriously consider leaving. No kidding. I said that to my colleagues prior to the federal election. Nothing is worse that those parties who try to make a nanny state at the expense of real hardworking professionals. NDP can stay in Quebec. We don't need it.
 
What are you talking about. Canada is under Harper's majority government, which I think is doing all the right things to make Canada a better and more compeitive country.

If NDP does come into power, I will seriously consider leaving. No kidding. I said that to my colleagues prior to the federal election. Nothing is worse that those parties who try to make a nanny state at the expense of real hardworking professionals. NDP can stay in Quebec. We don't need it.

You know, this is something that both Ford and Harper tapped into.

I mean, the "enlightened" view of multiculturalism is that it brings people from rich foreign cultures into our home and native land, and enriching our own through diversity. On the contrary, a whole lot of them came to Canada to flee those "rich foreign cultures", thinking this was some kind of culture-free, regulation-free la-la land where we can all do our own thing without persecution

The Philistine Multiculturals, maybe one can call them.
 
Kkgg7 may represent a fairly extreme view but to be honest many reasonable Canadians feel that more NDP would be a bad thing.
 

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