[nfitz]

It shouldn't be surprising! The way this election has turned out, Tory is the only option for informed voters who occupy the vast middle ground of the political spectrum. When your alternatives are the NDP affiliated Olivia Chow and Doug Ford, who else are you going to support?

How is Tory possibly an option for those who are centrist, given his past comments about women, his leading a right-wing party whose main platform plank that he added was funding religious schools, and his endorsement and funding of both Fords during the 2010 election?

 

[Greg Banks]

How is Tory possibly an option for those who are centrist, given his past comments about women, his leading a right-wing party whose main platform plank that he added was funding religious schools, and his endorsement and funding of both Fords during the 2010 election?

I'll make it short and sweet...Centrists are pragmatists not ideologues (sic).

 

[salsa]

It shouldn't be surprising! The way this election has turned out, Tory is the only option for informed voters who occupy the vast middle ground of the political spectrum. When your alternatives are the NDP affiliated Olivia Chow and Doug Ford, who else are you going to support?

So whoever doesn't vote Tory are uninformed voters. Chow is not an alternative because she's NPD. I guess Ari Goldkind doesn't count as an alternative for centrists.

 

[SunriseChampion]

At this point, I think that a lot of people see Tory as a guaranteed ticket out of crazy town. Can't really blame them. No sane person wants a continuation of the Ford joke/disaster/shitstorm.

 

[Palma]

How is Tory possibly an option for those who are centrist, given his past comments about women, his leading a right-wing party whose main platform plank that he added was funding religious schools, and his endorsement and funding of both Fords during the 2010 election?

You have obviously never listeded to Tory on 1010 when he had the slot 4-7pm. I never had a good view of Tory since he is a PC member but I started listening before I knew he was the host. He is a very pragmatic guy. Did not sound very conservative and countless people called in to say he was a closet Liberal. I am not sure if you are referring to when Tory commented on women taking up golf to get ahead because thats where many deals are done, but the reality is I have heard this referenced so many times over the years. Most people have about business getting done on the golf course so it was not sexist and i am a woman. Thsi notion about someone somewhere getting offended when someone says something has become ridiculous.

 

[nfitz]

At this point, I think that a lot of people see Tory as a guaranteed ticket out of crazy town. Can't really blame them. No sane person wants a continuation of the Ford joke/disaster/shitstorm.

I don't see how that isn't obtained with just about any other mayoral candidate ... well perhaps not white supremacist and neo-Nazi Don Andrews (at least that's what Wikipedia calls him ...).

 

[nfitz]

I am not sure if you are referring to when Tory commented on women taking up golf to get ahead because thats where many deals are done, but the reality is I have heard this referenced so many times over the years.

Specifically I'm talking about the anti-John Tory ads that are currently running on Toronto TV stations. See http://www.torontosun.com/2014/10/09/groups-ad-paints-john-tory-as-out-of-touch and http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2014/10/09/john-tory-women-pay-gap-golf-union_n_5959480.html

Far more insulting than the incredibly sexist and misogynistic suggestion that women should play golf to get ahead, is his defence of the wage gap between men and women.

John Tory seems completely oblivious to and downplays both white privilege and male privilege. This extreme-right wing position is not generally the position of centrists.

 

[salsa]

I don't see how that isn't obtained with just about any other mayoral candidate ... well perhaps not white supremacist and neo-Nazi Don Andrews (at least that's what Wikipedia calls him ...).

Last time I checked, no one else is leading by double digits above the Fords.

 

[nfitz]

Last time I checked, no one else is leading by double digits above the Fords.

Oh, it's definitely Tory's to lose. No one else has a chance, based on all the polling.

But that doesn't mean that you slander those who don't support him, by calling them uninformed! If Ford was looking victorious, I could see your point, but that has never been the case. And I don't think your using NPD instead of NDP is very nice. And rather ironic given the NPD is a far right party - much closer to Tory than Chow.

Personally I can't stomach giving my vote to a man who has done so much wrong, and never apologizes. He hasn't even apologized for supporting Rob Ford in 2010. He doesn't even admit it was a mistake.

 

[SunriseChampion]

I don't see how that isn't obtained with just about any other mayoral candidate ... well perhaps not white supremacist and neo-Nazi Don Andrews (at least that's what Wikipedia calls him ...).

I agree and am voting for Goldkind. I was just offering up my opinion on the reason for the Tory love.

 

[Admiral Beez]

Far more insulting than the incredibly sexist and misogynistic suggestion that women should play golf to get ahead, is his defence of the wage gap between men and women.

John Tory seems completely oblivious to and downplays both white privilege and male privilege. This extreme-right wing position is not generally the position of centrists.

Nfitz, can you separate social engineering from the transactional nature of city government?

I can suppose you're going to spoil your ballot by voting for one of the candidates that doesn't stand a chance, be it Chow or whomever, but what is your goal with all these statements about Tory being extreme right wing? Is it just that you want the city to make a better informed choice and that they be aware of what you believe is Tory's true rightist vision behind the friendly cloak? If that's the case, I'd say you've done a fine job, mission accomplished, but come election day you're going to have to accept that nobody cared.

 

[Admiral Beez]

He hasn't even apologized for supporting Rob Ford in 2010. He doesn't even admit it was a mistake.

Nearly half of us voted for Ford. Do you want half a million apologies? And how do we know it was a mistake? Sure we've had distractions and scandals, but would the city have been better off with Smitherman? What would have been built, what would my tax bill be now? Would we repeat e-Health and waste millions?

 

[r937]

... you're going to spoil your ballot by voting for one of the candidates that doesn't stand a chance

maybe it's a bit out of context, but that statement sucks big time

voting for the candidate one feels is best suited for the job is NOT spoiling one's ballot

sheeeeit, i wish there were no polls at all, so this type of evil thinking would shrivel up and die

 

[nfitz]

I can suppose you're going to spoil your ballot by voting for one of the candidates that doesn't stand a chance.

Well I'm certainly not going to vote for John Tory. I don't see how that's spoliing a ballot ... do you suggest in every election that we all should just vote for the likely winner, instead of who we think is qualified to govern? I suppose if two candidates were neck-in-neck there might be a case for choosing one or the other ... but that's certainly not applicable in this election.

Nearly half of us voted for Ford. Do you want half a million apologies?

Quite frankly, anyone who was ignorant enough to vote for Ford should consider apologizing - many have. Sure, many people were just ignorant, but it was quite clear in the discussion here in 2010 that Rob Ford practices spousal abuse, child abuse, alcohol abuse, and was generally incompetent and would grossly embarrass the city. An average person on the street not paying attention might well get an out. But those contributing here - or professional political observers like John Tory knew exactly what Rob Ford was.

And how do we know it was a mistake? Sure we've had distractions and scandals, but would the city have been better off with Smitherman? What would have been built, what would my tax bill be now? Would we repeat e-Health and waste millions?

Good grief. Really? With what's currently going on in this city? Letting in a racist like Rob Ford has enabled racists through the city. I don't think we'd be seeing the kind of racism against Chow that we've seen in recent weeks if we hadn't opened the door to let Ford in. And your more worried about your Fording tax bill?? Really? Shame!

And did Rob Ford really save that much $? He never fought the unions as hard as Miller. He let the police union walk all over him. He gave the TTC guaranteed arbitration, taking away the city's ability to ever get future concessions there. He had very little control of council. He even raised taxes to extend the Scarborough subway - completely unnecessarily given there was a deal already in place with the province and feds to provide more transit to more people for a lower cost with $0 from the city. He had 2 budget successes early on. One was saving about $20 million privatizing garbage collection. And the other was using the city's reserve to freeze taxes in 2011. I don't really see how the latter actually saves much in long term. And surely the $20 million a year is destroyed by his police budget increase (let alone the $hundreds of million in new city taxes for the Scarborough subway).

 

[Tea]

maybe it's a bit out of context, but that statement sucks big time

voting for the candidate one feels is best suited for the job is NOT spoiling one's ballot

I agree.

While I think it makes sense to take into consideration the voting system in order to vote strategically, and sometimes it means voting for one's second or third choice- it also makes sense to vote for the person one likes the most- the will to support a candidate and do something to contribute in what you believe in.
How people vote is a matter of their principles. And people have the right to chose, for whatever reason. It's kind of insulting for someone else to say that one vote or another is "wasted".