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Yes. In most developed countries only about 15% of the population defend creationism. When you consider people of the stature of Tory that number dwindles even further.

This guy is a complete disaster of a candidate, and Toronto are too shell-shocked to react. This is our Korean war, people don't want to ask questions, they just want to leave the Ford era behind.

Where did you get those numbers from? And views aren't necessarily extreme (based on the negative connotation nfitz attaches to the word) just because they aren't popular. The validity of a certain belief isn't based on whether it is fashionable. People can reasonably disagree on the creation of the universe.
 
I was planning on voting for Soknacki. Ari Goldkind would be my second choice, however, he has no chance at winning. It will come down to Ford, Chow, or Tory. Neither of which I like. Tory I dislike the least of the bunch, so I will probably vote for him, reluctantly.

We are all voting against Ford sadly. Rather then voting for the best person.
 
Don't do it. At least Chow will let people who have a clue work towards fixing the city. Pretty much all the planners I know are scared of the prospect of dealing with Tory. Don't let his 'centre/forward' posture fool you, he's the anti-Soknacki (who was of course the best candidate of the bunch).

Can you expand on this or is this just conjecture/anecdote?

If that is true, then it would effectively change my vote to Chow. My only reservations about changing my vote from Tory right now is the belief that he'd work better with city planners, other councilors and other levels of government.
 
Just yesterday you said you never called John Tory a racist.
My views are evolving. He supported a racist, he is a racist.

Anyone who knowingly support a racist is a racist. Yes, I know I was softer on him previously, as I was somewhat reluctantly willing to give him the benefit of the doubt over this Rob Ford support. But the more I pondered it yesterday, the more pissed off I became. Sure, perhaps some rube in Etobicrack or Scarberia might not be aware. However Rob Ford's racism was widely discussed during the 2010 election - including here, I'm sure you remember. And John Tory's job at the time was to pay attention to such stuff. It's difficult to swallow that he didn't know about Rob Ford's racism.

Hence the evolution of my position.

Huh, so believing in creationism makes one extreme?
To the point of advocating the provision of public money to allow creationism to be taught in schools - yes.

Calling people bigots like you have a stuttering problem is the epitome of extreme.
Really, I'm supposed to take the opinion of someone who has spent today highlight Adolf Hitler's good points seriously? ROTFLMAO.

Your favourite band must be Extreme. Are you by chance, Nuno Bettencourt?
I've not heard of either of those people.

Frankly, he's new, and he put up a good one against you nfitz.
How does pointing out Adolf Hitler's good qualities put up a good one?

You say all this stuff about Tory know full well he is the only chance we have to get rid of Ford.
Doug Ford hasn't got a hope in hell of achieving 33%. He can't win, no matter who people vote for. To think otherwise is falling for the dirty tricks of Nick Kouvalis, who is trying to make people think otherwise. Nick Kouvalis - former chief of staff under Rob Ford ... another racist supporter. This isn't like 2010 where Rob Ford was leading the polls. At this point in 2010, the September polls showed Ford with 39%, 46%, and 46% with no one else better than 26%. If Doug Ford starts showing those numbers, even I'd vote for John Tory if he was running second. But this isn't the case.

None of this has anything to do with the elect
It has everything to do with the election. Yesterday, John Tory showed that he is an anti-gay bigot with his announcement that he would defund Pride if a certain group attended Pride. I've seen similar signs at York University - would it be okay to defund York University if such a group had signs on campus? To object to that group is fine. To select the only group you would defund being Pride demonstrates anti-gay bigotry.

Clearly John Tory is prejudiced. If you support John Tory ...

I was planning on voting for Soknacki. Ari Goldkind would be my second choice, however, he has no chance at winning. It will come down to Ford, Chow, or Tory. Neither of which I like. Tory I dislike the least of the bunch, so I will probably vote for him, reluctantly.
Ironically, this is exactly where I was at - though a little uncomfortable with Tory's association with Nick Kouvalis. However that went out the window with his anti-gay position yesterday. So who has the best chance of beating Tory other than Ford?
 
Seriously, can we write-in vote for Soknacki or something?

I thought I was going to end up voting Tory (something I thought I'd never do a few months ago) but now I am not so sure.

Can't do that.

[video=youtube_share;Tkax5S8Ro38]http://youtu.be/Tkax5S8Ro38[/video]

Other election videos are at this link.
 
Can you expand on this or is this just conjecture/anecdote?

If that is true, then it would effectively change my vote to Chow. My only reservations about changing my vote from Tory right now is the belief that he'd work better with city planners, other councilors and other levels of government.

Is there a reason why you think Tory would work better with others than Chow?
 
We are all voting against Ford sadly. Rather then voting for the best person.

We are all voting against Ford? Umm... No. I am not voting against Ford. I am voting for the person who I genuinely believe will be the best leader for our city. I'm not going to let opinion polls, that are very frequently inaccurate, dictate to me who I should vote for.
 
Oh re Hitler: I don't mind the 30s Autobahn aesthetic. Leni Riefenstahl has her place in cinematic history. The Volkswagen Beetle is iconic, etc etc
 
Is there a reason why you think Tory would work better with others than Chow?
Chow would alienate the far right-wing. Tory folds like bad poker hand, and would agree to just about anything, if it sounded rational at the time. (which is I expect how he keeps agreeing to such bizarre things).
 
Oh re Hitler: I don't mind the 30s Autobahn aesthetic. Leni Riefenstahl has her place in cinematic history. The Volkswagen Beetle is iconic, etc etc

The first portion of the Autobahn started construction in 1929 and opened in 1932. Hitler became Chancellor of Germany in 1933. Hitler took credit as more portions of the Autobahn opened, claiming that he built them when in fact they started construction before he came into power.

Sounds familiar.
 
Hey watts: Sometimes I think you're just a massive troll, or you might just have a learning disability. It's as if you're purposely trying to get under the skin of others by completely misinterpreting what others say,

Don't sully Nuno Bettencourt

At first I thought you had some points but....
Fixed that for me

ETA we aren't far apart politically I hoped for Chow, became disillusioned, would have settled for Socknaki, am impressed with Goldkind. Wish Domise was a candidate for mayor. But.... prolly have to go Chow now that rofo is out. I would have voted Tory to stop ford. Its the tone that is offensive. Just one wife beating is enough for me to write off everything about a candidate. Never mind serial murder and genocide.
 
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The first portion of the Autobahn started construction in 1929 and opened in 1932. Hitler became Chancellor of Germany in 1933. Hitler took credit as more portions of the Autobahn opened, claiming that he built them when in fact they started construction before he came into power.

Sounds familiar.

Autobahns, autobahns,autobahns
 
How does pointing out Adolf Hitler's good qualities put up a good one?
It was a bad example but at least he didn't back down from you.
Doug Ford hasn't got a hope in hell of achieving 33%. He can't win, no matter who people vote for. To think otherwise is falling for the dirty tricks of Nick Kouvalis, who is trying to make people think otherwise. Nick Kouvalis - former chief of staff under Rob Ford ... another racist supporter. This isn't like 2010 where Rob Ford was leading the polls. At this point in 2010, the September polls showed Ford with 39%, 46%, and 46% with no one else better than 26%. If Doug Ford starts showing those numbers, even I'd vote for John Tory if he was running second. But this isn't the case.
The very first poll Doug Ford was mentioned had him at 34 percent. Tory at 41. He's only dropped to 28 percent in the last week. Tory is not going to cruise to victory at this point. Olivia is not winning. She had a 9 month lead and blew it.
It has everything to do with the election. Yesterday, John Tory showed that he is an anti-gay bigot with his announcement that he would defund Pride if a certain group attended Pride. I've seen similar signs at York University - would it be okay to defund York University if such a group had signs on campus? To object to that group is fine. To select the only group you would defund being Pride demonstrates anti-gay bigotry.

Clearly John Tory is prejudiced. If you support John Tory ...

The school crap doesn't and that is what I was talking about.
 
We are all voting against Ford? Umm... No. I am not voting against Ford. I am voting for the person who I genuinely believe will be the best leader for our city. I'm not going to let opinion polls, that are very frequently inaccurate, dictate to me who I should vote for.

So you think Olivia will win. She won't, its over. 7 days from October 1 and she is in third. Read This

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...g-for-olivia-chow/article20710655/?cmpid=rss1
It was an effort to rally the troops from a campaign on the ropes.

An internal letter from John Laschinger, the man masterminding Olivia Chow’s bid to become Toronto’s next mayor, outlined a change of direction as the former NDP MP collapsed in the polls.

“Let’s be clear,” Mr. Laschinger wrote to Ms. Chow’s supporters in the days before Labour Day, when the campaign would begin in earnest. “Ford and Tory are not progressive. Olivia is.”
More Related to this Story



Mere months before, Ms. Chow was the undisputed front-runner, all but certain to end the Ford era and lead a left-wing tidal wave back to power at city hall.

But now she was badly trailing John Tory according to a poll done by Forum Research in late August and faced the ignominious prospect of finishing behind Rob Ford himself.

Through conversations with campaign insiders, both on and off the record, The Globe and Mail has pieced together the behind-the-scenes story of how it went wrong – and Ms. Chow’s hail-Mary plan to turn it around.

In part, the campaign’s problem was picking the wrong target – going after Rob Ford instead of John Tory. As well, Ms. Chow did not stake out a progressive enough place on the spectrum, and failed to get her message across, sources close to her say. Sources close to Ms. Chow also blame the NDP’s ill-received provincial campaign in June – which ditched big-picture progressivism for small-ball populism – for rubbing off on Ms. Chow’s brand.

Now, with Rob Ford battling cancer and his outspoken older brother stepping in to take his place on the ballot, Ms. Chow has an opening.

“I have momentum on my side,” Ms. Chow said on Friday, standing on a windswept corner in Scarborough, where her proposal to bring back light rail and cancel a planned subway has failed to translate into the votes she was counting on.

The campaign plan is to polarize the race between Ms. Chow and Mr. Tory, and fight a war on two fronts, sources confide. On one, Ms. Chow will rally the left by emphasizing her progressive bona fides, rolling out new policy and arguing that Doug Ford has no hope of winning, so people don’t have to vote strategically. On the other, she will look to pull in erstwhile Ford supporters who would have backed the mayor but do not like his brother. And through it all, she will launch an all-out assault on Mr. Tory’s SmartTrack transit plan.

It’s now or never for Ms. Chow if she wants to be more than an afterthought on voting day.

The wrong target

The Chow campaign made the strategic mistake in the early days of focusing too much attention on doing battle with Rob Ford and too little on fighting Mr. Tory. In the early days of the race, sources in Ms. Chow’s circle repeatedly emphasized how she would fight to peel away Mr. Ford’s blue collar, new Canadian partisans in Scarborough and Etobicoke, in part by offering practical promises of service improvements, tapping into the sort of transactional politics Mr. Ford played in 2010.

Last spring, Ms. Chow put this strategy into action. A memoir, released before she joined the race, chronicled her experience coming of age as a new immigrant to Canada, her political victories and the heartbreaking loss of her husband Jack Layton. Others in the centre left, such as Adam Vaughan, who had aspirations about running for mayor were told to step aside. Ms. Chow was the one who would beat the mayor.

Ms. Chow made frequent stops in Scarborough in the spring, offering such things as better bus service, and online city services for small businesses. She framed the Scarborough LRT in practical terms: one source said her plan was to drum up support by targeting neighbourhoods that would be served by an LRT stop but not by a subway station. And she talked about “knowing the value of a dollar” – an assertion meant to defuse concern over her leftist credentials.

Ms. Chow’s team also appears to have underestimated Mr. Tory. Early on, a campaign source took a dismissive view of the former talk show host’s chances: his base of privileged North Toronto denizens was small compared with Ms. Chow’s broad inner-city support. Besides which, Mr. Tory would lose many possible right-wing voters to Mr. Ford.

Another campaign source confided at the time that Ms. Chow’s team was just as worried about the underfunded David Soknacki – who made a play for urbanist voters and also supported the Scarborough LRT – as they were about Mr. Tory’s well-heeled campaign.

Implicit in this calculation was the assumption Ms. Chow would win downtown and her most pressing concern had to be building support in the suburbs. But Mr. Tory has actually bested her in recent polls of the old city.

SmartTrack

Now that the Chow campaign is focused on Mr. Tory, his SmartTrack transit plan is its top target. Mr. Tory is proposing to add 53 kilometres of TTC commuter lines in existing GO corridors, and finance the city’s portion of the $8-billion project through assessment growth, known as tax-increment finance.

The Chow campaign’s largest mistake, one insider confides, was not pulling apart Mr. Tory’s transit proposal on its obvious technical problems as soon as it was released last spring. At the time, the insider said, the then-first-place campaign’s aim was to keep Mr. Tory in third and they feared that attacking SmartTrack on its merits would give it undue legitimacy.

Ms. Chow is now trying to rectify that error. She takes a shot at the plan every chance she gets – at debates, in interviews and at photo ops across the city designed to point out problems, such as the homes being built on the former right-of-way along Eglinton Avenue West, where Mr. Tory first suggested the line could run. Since then, he has said some tunnelling will be needed. Mr. Tory’s campaign declined to comment on this story.

“I think that the impact of Tory’s transit financing plan being as wobbly constructed as Ford’s is her real opening,” said George Smitherman, the former deputy premier and one of Ms. Chow’s highest-profile supports. “Tory has moved to where his radio crowd is, and I think voters will come to reject someone who builds their key platform on such a shoddy funding mechanism.”

The Ford Factor

The exit of the mayor from the race has given Ms. Chow an unexpected opportunity to try and turn things around. With Doug Ford yet to join debates and the mayor no longer there to take the spotlight, Ms. Chow’s organizers are hoping one-on-one debates between their candidate and Mr. Tory will work in their favour.

“John Tory is afraid of Olivia Chow head-to-head,” says Jamey Heath, her head of communications who took over the campaign’s war room after Ms. Chow parted ways with Liberal strategist Warren Kinsella.

Ms. Chow, who some insiders have suggested struggles in debates because English is not her first language, has gone on the offensive since she was overshadowed by the mayor and Mr. Tory in a debate at the Toronto Regional Board of Trade in early September. She has tried to make a positive out of a disadvantage, frequently saying she is not a “smooth talker or a fast talker,” but instead takes action.

The move has not closed the gap with Mr. Tory, but Mr. Heath says it will take time for the “new reality,” of a race without the mayor to set in.

In the end, the Chow campaign is banking on a volunteer network of about 6,000 branched out across the city to pull in votes for their candidate on Oct. 27, rather than an air war waged in expensive advertising.

And she can take some comfort from the many veteran politicos working for her. Mr. Laschinger was the architect of David Miller’s come-from-behind victory in 2003. Helping him is federal strategic guru Brian Topp, the social media savvy Jennifer Hollett and Nathan Rotman, a field work expert from the federal NDP.

But for her to have any hope of the ground game working, she must first make up some ground.

Pulling the vote can only put a candidate over the top if the gap is relatively small – say five or six percentage points – “to make it look like real a choice” on election day, said Patrick Gossage, a veteran of many campaigns who is rooting for Ms. Chow.

“Then,” he said. “We are laughing.”
 

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