[YEG imagineer]

It'll be interesting to see what happens after they see how much upgrade to the existing track is going to be needed to make a service like this not suck. Edmonton to Jasper currently takes 6.5 hours by train, if it keeps to schedule.

VIA chooses to keep the long time to arrive in Jasper at sunrise. The CN tracks are now majority double tracked from Edmonton to Jasper. If VIA had any interest in the west they could have a 4 to 4.5 hour train trip quite easily. Not great yet but with track improvements, 3 hours would not be out of the question.

 

[Coprolite]

VIA chooses to keep the long time to arrive in Jasper at sunrise. The CN tracks are now majority double tracked from Edmonton to Jasper. If VIA had any interest in the west they could have a 4 to 4.5 hour train trip quite easily. Not great yet but with track improvements, 3 hours would not be out of the question.

They haven't managed that in 30+ years and frequently take longer than scheduled. CN has had no reason to design or maintain that track for speeds faster than 80km/h since it was privatized.

 

[yeggator]

CN has been pretty eager to double-track their mainline, so that shouldn’t leave too much work between Edmonton and Jasper. CPKC on the other hand…

 

[Coprolite]

CN has been pretty eager to double-track their mainline, so that shouldn’t leave too much work between Edmonton and Jasper. CPKC on the other hand…

For more throughput of extremely long slow freight in both directions, yes.

 

[HappyJazzz]

For more throughput of extremely long slow freight in both directions, yes.

Well fortunately some Canadian scienticians have been working on solutions to such constraints!

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0191261523000565

 

[YEG imagineer]

Nice article. Except Canada unlike the US, does not have a Passenger Priority bill to ensure passenger trains get first access which is important for scheduled service.

 

[HappyJazzz]

Nice article. Except Canada unlike the US, does not have a Passenger Priority bill to ensure passenger trains get first access which is important for scheduled service.

Well then, that sounds like something that should be harmonized as part of the NAFTA v3 deal..

 

[Barnaby]

The current Canadian Government had 9 years to fix basic issues with commuter rail. They could have had a major HSR nearly built out by now. It's sad and pathetic.

 

[HappyJazzz]

The current Canadian Government had 9 years to fix basic issues with commuter rail. They could have had a major HSR nearly built out by now. It's sad and pathetic.

Oh come on now, what's sad and pathetic about a G7 nation being beaten to the HSR punch by a country that was being bombed into oblivion 50 years ago...

https://english.vov.vn/en/a-rising-vietnam/special-mechanisms-proposed-for-north-south-high-speed-railway-project-post1144066.vov

 

[Coprolite]

Well fortunately some Canadian scienticians have been working on solutions to such constraints!

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0191261523000565

View attachment 623803

The hard speed limit on CN's main line in its current state is 50 mph at the fastest. Running any train that is not incredibly slow on that line will require significant upgrades because of decades of CN having no reason to support any speeds higher than that. Integrating any kind of HSR into that line would require completely rebuilding the entire line. Any passenger rail project in this province that in any way works even as a regional commuter rail service is going to require a lot of work in a province where the government is extremely unserious about foresight or infrastructure and where funding streams depend entirely on the Saudis not opening the taps. We will be lucky to get Edmonton to Calgary at European regional rail speeds.

 

[HappyJazzz]

The hard speed limit on CN's main line in its current state is 50 mph at the fastest. Running any train that is not incredibly slow on that line will require significant upgrades because of decades of CN having no reason to support any speeds higher than that. Integrating any kind of HSR into that line would require completely rebuilding the entire line. Any passenger rail project in this province that in any way works even as a regional commuter rail service is going to require a lot of work in a province where the government is extremely unserious about foresight or infrastructure and where funding streams depend entirely on the Saudis not opening the taps. We will be lucky to get Edmonton to Calgary at European regional rail speeds.

Rail speed limits in the United States - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Per the above, the fastest mixed use track in the US has a top speed of 145kph, which is ok-ish.

I suppose the provinces report will say whether its cheaper to upgrade CN or run new rails for passenger service.

It'd be nice to see 200kph min for the regional lines, and 400kph for the Calgary link, much like the Cascade project in the US.

Eager to see the report, hopefully there are some clever creative people working on it!

 

[Coprolite]

Rail speed limits in the United States - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Per the above, the fastest mixed use track in the US has a top speed of 145kph, which is ok-ish.

I suppose the provinces report will say whether its cheaper to upgrade CN or run new rails for passenger service.

It'd be nice to see 200kph min for the regional lines, and 400kph for the Calgary link, much like the Cascade project in the US.

Eager to see the report, hopefully there are some clever creative people working on it!

There is at least an upside to being able to use the same ROW (ie less land acquisition), but those 145km/h limits are in a few very wide-open places with easy grades and very straight track, and the CN line rather does wiggle its way up to the Rockies on account of topography. 400 km/h isn't anything we'll see for Calgary. Pushing above 300 is very rapidly diminishing returns territory.

 

[HappyJazzz]

There is at least an upside to being able to use the same ROW (ie less land acquisition), but those 145km/h limits are in a few very wide-open places with easy grades and very straight track, and the CN line rather does wiggle its way up to the Rockies on account of topography. 400 km/h isn't anything we'll see for Calgary. Pushing above 300 is very rapidly diminishing returns territory.

Well I couldn't find any info on what train they are planning to use on the Cascade routes, I did find this report which confirms what you said about diminishing returns.

How fast is too fast for high-speed rail?

The right speed for a high-speed rail line comes down to trade-offs among many important factors. So how do regulators, investors, developers and other stakeholders ultimately decide what the optimal speed should be?

infrastructure.aecom.com

It does seem like 300 kph is the overall sweet spot, and that could still be fast enough to do the DT to DT trip in not much more than an hour, which should be the service goal for the line IMO.

 

[fromyeg]

Things were going well until they suggested considering hyperloop.

 

[EdmTrekker]

The current Canadian Government had 9 years to fix basic issues with commuter rail. They could have had a major HSR nearly built out by now. It's sad and pathetic.

I don’t think a change in political parties will “fix basic issues with commuter rail”...what ever you mean by that nor will have major HSR nearly built out (where?) in the next 9 years.