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That was my knee jerk reaction also, but then I got on Google Maps and started looking at the highway network up that way. Hay River is not a "remote" community - the whole area is serviced by the MacKenzie Highway, a 2-lane hard surfaced road. The highway continues another 400 kms on to Yellowknife, with many branches and serving many communities along the way. It's 1009 kms Enterprise to Edmonton, so not an easy drive and likely very expensive to truck things in.... but not comparable to say Churchill where absent the railway, things would have to be flown in.

One could take a technocratic approach and try to rationalise the overall transportation expense of the entire transportation network north of, say, High Level AB ( which is where the highway meets the provincial road network) and ask if we are paying too much for roads and too little for rail....but.... I suspect the road is a must-have for the First Nations and other communities up that way. So the question becomes, is the rail link really worthwhile to maintain as an incremental resource given that the highway will always remain available (and its ongoing cost cannot be avoided or minimised by encouraging rail use instead).

And that begs the question, what are the economics of a transload at Enterprise versus maintaining the rail to Hay River.

Even without CN's allegedly greedy paws in the mix, I can see the economics saying the Hay River portion is expendable. It doesn't feel good giving it up, but I suspect few shippers transload from train to barge to cross the Slave Lake any more. So the harbour connection at Hay River is already abandoned.

- Paul
The issue, the way I understanding it, is not barging freight across Great Slave Lake to Yellowknife, but down the MacKenzie River to serve the western Arctic. The way I understand it, the harbour at Hay River is not abandoned but service down the river has been suspended due to low water levels. Freight, including bulk liquids, is now being re-routed via the Dempster Highway. Edmonton to Hay River is approx. 1000km; Edmonton the Tuktoyaktuk is 3400.

I would imagine freight, especially bulk commodities being shipped by rail to Enterprise, then transloaded to truck, then transloaded to barge would add significant cost.

Also, if CN uses reduced traffic in future years, because freight is now diverted, to abandoned the entire subdivision, perhaps the local can see the writing on the wall. It wouldn't be the first time a Class 1 has let a line deteriorate then used unprofitability as grounds for abandonment.
 
From south of the border.

Total SF

A ‘gently used’ Caltrain locomotive is for sale — but there’s a 135-ton catch​

By Peter Hartlaub,Culture Critic Aug 13, 2024

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A worker climbs into an engine of a train as it sits at the Caltrain Station in San Francisco on December 21, 2017.
Michael Short/Special to The Chronicle

A surprising item showed up on the new Caltrain online store this week alongside the tote bags, T-shirts and transit-themed ugly holiday sweaters:

A listing for “gently used, lovingly maintained” 135-ton diesel locomotives; perfect for anyone with a love of trains, a lot of extra space and the ability to move something that weighs a little more than an adult blue whale.

The historic 1985 F40 diesel locomotives “come with 40 years of service, and more than 1,000,000 miles traveled,” the item listing reads. “Perfect for your model train set, train-themed diners … unconventional bed and breakfast, or just to show up your overly gnomed neighbor’s lawn.”

That description makes the listing sound like parody, but Caltrain spokesman Dan Lieberman insists the sale is very real.

“These locomotives have been helping to get our riders to get where they need to go for nearly a quarter century,” he said. “Sadly, decommissioned locomotives often get scrapped for parts, and we’d much rather these engines find a home with collectors, artists or anyone else looking to own a piece of railroad history.”

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Caltrain is selling 20 of its diesel locomotives, all built between 1985 and 1987, to make way for its new electrified fleet of trains.Courtesy Caltrain

Bay Area transit agencies have a robust recent history of recycling train and subway cars. A local couple recently sold a 1970s Muni streetcar, which will be recycled in the North Bay as a glamping destination. BART has unloaded scores of its 1970s cars for the price of transportation, destined to be used as a video game arcade, Airbnbs and a clubhouse for Oakland’s Scraper Bike Team.

Those cars could be mounted on large flatbed trailers, and carted away to pretty much anywhere in the state. BART estimated the costs to clean its cars and transport them at about $10,000.

Lieberman couldn’t name an exact price, but purchasing one of the 20 available Caltrain locomotives will not be inexpensive, or free from logistical headaches. (As the old saying goes: If you have to ask how much it costs to buy a used diesel locomotive, you probably can’t afford one.)

The only practical way to move an F40 locomotive is by rail. Sacramento-based Siemens Mobility, for example, manufactures its locomotives at a factory adjacent to a rail line. Any other method would require disassembling the car and moving it on multiple trailers. But the exact logistics will likely come later.

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Two locomotives sit next to each other at the Caltrain station in San Francisco on December 21, 2017.
Michael Short/Special to The Chronicle

The fully operational locomotives, all built between 1985 and 1987, are being retired to make way for the debut of Caltrain’s electric locomotive fleet, which debuted in San Francisco on Saturday with a host of politicians including Gov. Gavin Newsom and former U.S. House Speaker Nancy Pelosi.

But if you’re thinking of building your own rail line, better read the fine print.

Part of Caltrain’s state grant for its electrification requires its diesel locomotives to be decommissioned and disabled. In other words, you can use them as a play structure, but not to haul the grandchildren around your yard. (Or haul your herd of Herefords to an East Coast slaughterhouse.)

Still reading? The locomotives officially go on sale in October, when Caltrain may have more information about the pricing. In the meantime, Lieberman said the attention is a win for the transit agency.

“Trying to sell them to a wider range of people and organizations through the online store seemed like a good way of trying to preserve these historical engines,” he said. “Plus, it’s just plain fun and unexpected.”

Reach Peter Hartlaub: phartlaub@sfchronicle.com; Twitter: @PeterHartlaub

 
Even the guy operating the facility in Hay River doesn't seem too disturbed or surprised at this. It's not like CN is ending service to NWT, just the shortish spur north of Enterprise that no longer has as much purpose or potential profit. Which will only get worse as the Mackenzie River has less flow, and the Mackenzie Highway is completed.
 
Even the guy operating the facility in Hay River doesn't seem too disturbed or surprised at this. It's not like CN is ending service to NWT, just the shortish spur north of Enterprise that no longer has as much purpose or potential profit. Which will only get worse as the Mackenzie River has less flow, and the Mackenzie Highway is completed.

If there's some kind of bulk transfer facility in Enterprise.

 
I was reading the link thinking 'there must be an industry 'buy-and-sell' the shortlines and tourist railways keep their eye on, then I read the mandatory decommissioning requirement.

Tough sell.

The US locomotive market has all sorts of complicated tax credits and manufacturer restrictions on buying and reusing locomotives.
Some of that is manufacturers stacking the deck for new orders, and some is incenting the move to lower emission models. And some is the complexity of financing and leasing arrangements.
I know of a railroad that started refurbishing retired loco hulks…. Not because they needed them returned to service, but because there was a better tax credit for trading in operable old locomotives than for replacing worn out ones. The locos, after repairs, went right to the scrapyard…

- Paul
 
The US locomotive market has all sorts of complicated tax credits and manufacturer restrictions on buying and reusing locomotives.
Some of that is manufacturers stacking the deck for new orders, and some is incenting the move to lower emission models. And some is the complexity of financing and leasing arrangements.
I know of a railroad that started refurbishing retired loco hulks…. Not because they needed them returned to service, but because there was a better tax credit for trading in operable old locomotives than for replacing worn out ones. The locos, after repairs, went right to the scrapyard…

- Paul
What teeth do these "manufacturer restrictions" have?
 
What teeth do these "manufacturer restrictions" have?

To be honest, I’m not an expert. What I know is that very few railroads own their locomotives outright. The majority are leased or have financing arrangements from third parties which have contractual, accounting, and tax implications.
It’s common for the major scrapyards and locomotive dealers to acquire retired locomotives on condition that they not be resold or parted out.
And then there were the electric locomotives that Amtrak sidelined as poor performers… but the condition of the lease required Amtrak to maintain the locomotives in ready to operate condition for the full lease term, so the locomotives continued to receive 90 day inspections but never turned a wheel in service…..
It’s a bit like those user agreements that you accept when you load an app on your phone…. Does anyone read them end to end before accepting ? Railroads do.

- Paul
 
The US locomotive market has all sorts of complicated tax credits and manufacturer restrictions on buying and reusing locomotives.
Some of that is manufacturers stacking the deck for new orders, and some is incenting the move to lower emission models. And some is the complexity of financing and leasing arrangements.
I know of a railroad that started refurbishing retired loco hulks…. Not because they needed them returned to service, but because there was a better tax credit for trading in operable old locomotives than for replacing worn out ones. The locos, after repairs, went right to the scrapyard…

- Paul
When government funding is available and allocated for replacements, It's even worse than than that.

California in particular is infamous for providing replacement loco funding - always to a higher emissions standard than before - and requiring the destruction of the older units being replaced. Presumably, this is being done on the pretext of "being better for the environment if no one can use the old crap that we've replaced". It seems a bit silly to us outsiders, but it's also their prerogative to attach those strings to the funding.

In this case, Caltrans has gotten a LOT of funding for their electric system from the State, with the understanding that as many of their older diesels as possible - most of which are in reasonably good shape, and having been upgraded are only a couple of Tiers out of date - get destroyed with no opportunity of rebuilding or reuse as a locomotive.

Dan
 
Even the guy operating the facility in Hay River doesn't seem too disturbed or surprised at this. It's not like CN is ending service to NWT, just the shortish spur north of Enterprise that no longer has as much purpose or potential profit. Which will only get worse as the Mackenzie River has less flow, and the Mackenzie Highway is completed.

The biggest issue seems to the fuel supply which comes in by rail and the sheer number of trucks requires to replace it.

But it seems like it can be managed.
 

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