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rbt said:
Basically, until Presto V1 is eliminated entirely, every fare structure they failed to consider by 2006 is now difficult; far from impossible but much more expensive than seems reasonable.
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Presto cards have an expiry date. They're not enforced right now but I think they could replace all the cards in around 5 years, assuming there's the political will (and the money from the TTC) to do that

Napoleon said:
The other difference is that a day pass on the weekend is valid for 2 adults and 4 "youths" 19 and under or 1 adult and 5 "youths" 19 and under. That's rather tricky to figure out how to program into Presto...not really sure how that would ever work.
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W. K. Lis said:
They'll have to create a website where they can combine various PRESTO card numbers together, before they use it on a weekend. When they're in the same vicinity (IE. same subway station entrance within 5 minutes) on a weekend day, all the PRESTO cards will be the "weekend day pass", within the criteria needed. They'll need to designate which "adult" will be the "holder", and must be in the group.
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More likely, the TTC could just get rid of the group day pass. As it stands Toronto is the only subway system in North America that has a cheap group pass. Philadelphia is the only other one with a group pass at all, but they charge you 13 cash fares for one.

This would also be impossible without major changes to how Presto works, since information is stored locally on the card and the cards can't pass information to/from other cards.
 
I discovered yesterday (last to know, as usual) that Presto will not be the payment card for KW Transit.

KW is developing its own card.

So much for universality and getting the biggest bang for the buck out of the Presto investment.

The guy who told me this drives tor Kitchener Transit - he said he already encounters situations where riders hop off a GO bus, hop on the KW bus, and discover they can't use Presto. This may be a small thing now, but as GO grows it will become a more frequent inconvenience.

- Paul
 
crs1026 said:
KW is developing its own card.

So much for universality and getting the biggest bang for the buck out of the Presto investment.
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The price premium on Presto for integration isn't worth it for KW. It's worth it to the province but the province seems to think local agencies should pickup the costs of their massively over-priced program.

10% of revenue + millions in initial capital (see recent 905 and Ottawa renewal negotiations) is well above what KW should end up paying from a fresh tender. Actually, there's no reason why Presto couldn't make a submission on that tender too.
 
Just digging on the GRT (K/W/Cambridge) card. The choice of name is fodder for misunderstanding from the 'Get-GO':
EasyGO Fare Card - Frequently Asked Questions
1. What is the EasyGO Fare Card?
The EasyGO Fare Card is an electronic fare card that uses smart-card technology to storefunds in a secure account. Customers can load their fare either online or in person. The EasyGO Fare Card will replace the need for paper tickets, monthly passes and cash, although cash payment will still be an option. When you tap the EasyGO Fare Card on a fare payment device, the electronic chip embedded in the card will instantly calculatethe fare you owe and deduct it from your account or verify your monthly pass.

2. Why the name EasyGO Fare Card?
EasyGo Fare Card was chosen because it is a strong brand our customers are familiar with. It complements GRT's existing EasyGO brand of products including Trip Planner, Next Bus Text, Next Bus Call, Real-time Desktop Map and Mobile App - which all make taking transit easy.

3. When will the EasyGO Fare Card be available?
GRT expects to launch the card in late 2016 or early 2017 following a pilot test of the system.

4. Where can I use the EasyGO Fare Card?
The EasyGO Fare Card will be accepted for fare payment on all transportation services provided by the Region of Waterloo. They include, GRT conventional buses, specialized transit (MobilityPLUS), BusPLUS, Kiwanis Transit, ION Bus Rapid Transit and the future ION Light Rail Transit.

5. What are the benefits of the EasyGO Fare Card?
There are a number of benefits to using the EasyGO Fare Card. It will allow you to travel seamlessly on GRT's family of services with just one card - this includes ION train service. You can add money to your card either in person or online. By registering your card you will protect the money you store on it. Should your card be lost or stolen, any products on it can be transferred to a replacement card.

6. I am an Adult Monthly Pass, Reduced Monthly Pass, T.R.I.P, Reduced Ticket user; will I still be able to purchase these fares?
GRT's current fare products will continue to be offered, with some slight changes to adapt to the new technology. Customers will load the fare type of their choice onto the EasyGO Fare Card. For instance, if you are a Reduced Monthly Pass user you can continue to purchase that pass, but it will be stored on the EasyGO Fare Card.

In place of tickets, the card will store the value of your tickets. When you tap your card to a fare payment device, the value of your ticket will be deducted from the value stored on your card. If you are a Reduced Ticket user, the amount deducted would be the price of a Reduced Ticket.

You can carry a pass and Stored Value (tickets) on a card at the same time. If you have a valid pass on the card, then the pass will be used for payment until it expires.

A minimum amount of $10 must be loaded on the card; therefore you cannot load a single fare ride onto your EasyGO Fare Card. If you wish to ride only once, you may continue to pay cash.

7. What will happen to GRT's current fare boxes?
GRT will be working to replace its existing fare boxes with new ones capable of reading the EasyGO Fare Card. This process will take place over summer/fall 2016. These new fare boxes will continue to accept our current fare products, however they will no longer accept bills or pennies. If you are paying your fare with cash, please have exact change. The new farebox does not issue change.

8. Why wasn't Presto selected?
Presto could not be selected because they did not respond to a Request for Proposals, which is a Regional requirement. Also, Presto could not provide many of the functionalities that the Region deemed essential for our system including the ability to accept payment on MobilityPLUS vehicles, the ability to integrate a U-Pass program and the ability to issue machine readable paper tickets from Ticket Vending Machines. Having our own system allows us to ensure our fare products meet our unique customer needs.

9. What will happen to the $.50 Connect to GO for GO train riders?
We will continue the current Connect-to-GO discount program with the new system.

10. How do transfers work?
Transfers will be built right into your EasyGO Fare Card. Once you tap your card on the fare box it will automatically provide you with a 90 minute window to transfer to your next bus or to ION. However, if you pay for your fare with cash, you will need to push the button on the farebox to get a paper transfer before inserting your last coin.
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http://www.grt.ca/en/fares/EasyGO-FAQ.asp

Note: [8. Why wasn't Presto selected?
Presto could not be selected because they did not respond to a Request for Proposals, which is a Regional requirement. Also, Presto could not provide many of the functionalities that the Region deemed essential for our system including the ability to accept payment on MobilityPLUS vehicles, the ability to integrate a U-Pass program and the ability to issue machine readable paper tickets from Ticket Vending Machines. Having our own system allows us to ensure our fare products meet our unique customer needs.]

Ouch!
 
Those needs don't sound all that unique, but the one I can't argue with is cost. It is appealing to look for ways to use Presto as a broader based payment card, to get economy of scale and add convenience, but Horton's is not going to pay Presto a 7% service fee if Interac is charging less for debit, or if Tim's cards cost them even less to manage.

Hopefully with time the number of discrete payment media we all need will decrease.

- Paul
 
I wrote to Parks about the PRESTO idea for the ferry in early 2016. I got this reply:

Thank you for your suggestion regarding the use of PRESTO cards for Ferry Ticketing. We are currently investigating the feasibility of this payment method for ticketing and pass holders on our ferries.

We expect to have a recommendation regarding the use of PRESTO cards for Ferry Ticketing by the end of March. If the recommendation is favourable, a business case for this potential project would be created and go forward for approval.

If approved, this project would be assessed based on priority, along with the many other projects being considered, and then scheduled accordingly.

Thank you for your interest in Parks, Forestry and Recreation.

Halina Cieszynska
Project Manager, Business Transformation

I will ask her what happened and, if I get a response, will post.
 
amnesiajune said:
More likely, the TTC could just get rid of the group day pass. As it stands Toronto is the only subway system in North America that has a cheap group pass. Philadelphia is the only other one with a group pass at all, but they charge you 13 cash fares for one.

This would also be impossible without major changes to how Presto works, since information is stored locally on the card and the cards can't pass information to/from other cards.
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The weekend group pass (2 adults) encourages transit use - definitely worth keeping it.
They can program it to allow for double-tap during the weekend. The second tap will tell the fare gate to count two people before closing (or extend the time before closing)
 
I don't understand why the government would expect the average TTC rider to use Presto instead of their Metropass. If you take transit 50 times a month, which is common for regular transit users, you would pay a hell of a lot more for Presto than a Metropass.
I also find it unfair that you get a discount on the UPX with your Presto card but not with your Metropass.
 
ssiguy2 said:
I don't understand why the government would expect the average TTC rider to use Presto instead of their Metropass. If you take transit 50 times a month, which is common for regular transit users, you would pay a hell of a lot more for Presto than a Metropass.
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Simply beause they won't make Metropasses any more. What difference does it make - you'd buy a Metropass, and load it on your Presto Card.

ssiguy2 said:
I also find it unfair that you get a discount on the UPX with your Presto card but not with your Metropass.
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You can't use your Metropass, or your Balzac's Coffee loyalty card on UPX. Is it unfair you don't get a discount with your Balzac's Coffee loyalty card on UPX?
 
amnesiajune said:
On top of that, someone who uses transit less than 49 times a month can pay per trip and still get the tax credit. As long as you're making 32 one-way trips in 31 days, you can claim them.
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That makes using PRESTO for 32 trips in a month much more attractive than a MetroPass to get the Public Transit Tax Credit. See link.
 
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