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micheal_can said:
Which is why I am doubtful of its return, but with enough political support and taxpayer money, anything is possible.
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Which is what confuses me. You say they could/should do this and that, then follow it up with statements that it won't happen. Do you just like proposing fantasies for their own sake?
 
lenaitch said:
Which is what confuses me. You say they could/should do this and that, then follow it up with statements that it won't happen. Do you just like proposing fantasies for their own sake?
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I like looking at the ideas presented, figure out technically how to do it, and then look at the financial/political implications of it and say how it could be done, and whether it would be done. So, I have laid out options on how to get a train to Orillia, but I also have looked at the basics of whether it would be financially feasible or politically feasible. Maybe, if the province decides to make the areas along the Bala Sub and north Newmarket Sub, it might be more realistic. However, they are still focused on the areas south of Barrie, so not likely to happen.
 
Urban Sky said:
Given that Ontario Northland’s facilities are in Cochrane and the Southbound train only arrives Cochrane at 10pm, I don’t see any compelling case for extending the Polar Bear Express to Timmins…
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Assuming that the restored Northlander will run daily, or at least 6 times a week - would it help to split the schedule between Timmins and Cochrane?

For example, 2 trips per week from Toronto to Cochrane, arriving and departing on 2 of the days when the Polar Bear Express departs / arrives. On those days, the Polar Bear customers would be able to connect to Toronto with just one transfer.

And the remaining 4 or 5 Northlander trips per week would go to Timmins.
 
Rainforest said:
Assuming that the restored Northlander will run daily, or at least 6 times a week - would it help to split the schedule between Timmins and Cochrane?

For example, 2 trips per week from Toronto to Cochrane, arriving and departing on 2 of the days when the Polar Bear Express departs / arrives. On those days, the Polar Bear customers would be able to connect to Toronto with just one transfer.

And the remaining 4 or 5 Northlander trips per week would go to Timmins.
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What is the problem you are trying to fix?
 
micheal_can said:
I like looking at the ideas presented, figure out technically how to do it, and then look at the financial/political implications of it and say how it could be done, and whether it would be done. So, I have laid out options on how to get a train to Orillia, but I also have looked at the basics of whether it would be financially feasible or politically feasible. Maybe, if the province decides to make the areas along the Bala Sub and north Newmarket Sub, it might be more realistic. However, they are still focused on the areas south of Barrie, so not likely to happen.
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From what I see, you draw lines on a map and say 'they should do this'.
 
micheal_can said:
I like looking at the ideas presented, figure out technically how to do it, and then look at the financial/political implications of it and say how it could be done, and whether it would be done. So, I have laid out options on how to get a train to Orillia, but I also have looked at the basics of whether it would be financially feasible or politically feasible. Maybe, if the province decides to make the areas along the Bala Sub and north Newmarket Sub, it might be more realistic. However, they are still focused on the areas south of Barrie, so not likely to happen.
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And when there is absolutely no public political or bureaucratic focus out there asking for this solution - or even proposing a problem statement that leads to your suggested solution - and the costs are obviously enormous, then you have stepped over the line into a fantasy discussion.

If you are suggesting that as a matter of public policy, Ontario's urban centers of a certain size should be reconnected to the railway passenger grid through new construction of rail lines, fine. Now put Orillia (pop 31,285) on the list behind Owen Sound (pop 32,000) Orangeville (36,490), St Thomas (pop 38,909) New Tecumseth (pop 43,948) Sault Ste Marie (pop 73,020) Cambridge (pop 125,063) and Peterborough (pop 128,624) - and wait your turn.

- Paul
 
Urban Sky said:
What is the problem you are trying to fix?
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If the train goes to Timmins every day, and never to Cochrane: someone travelling from Moosonee to Toronto will need to transfer twice. From the Polar Bear train to bus in Cochrane, then from the bus to the Northlander at Matheson.
 
Rainforest said:
If the train goes to Timmins every day, and never to Cochrane: someone travelling from Moosonee to Toronto will need to transfer twice. From the Polar Bear train to bus in Cochrane, then from the bus to the Northlander at Matheson.
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How many people do you think travel between Toronto and Timmins vs. Toronto and Moosonee? My understanding is also that Moosonee-Cochrane is mostly local travel and that hardly any tourist going to Moosonee actually stays there overnight. Therefore, doing Toronto-Moosonnee overnight in either direction strikes me as rather hardcore…
 
Urban Sky said:
How many people do you think travel between Toronto and Timmins vs. Toronto and Moosonee? My understanding is also that Moosonee-Cochrane is mostly local travel and that hardly any tourist going to Moosonee actually stays there overnight. Therefore, doing Toronto-Moosonnee overnight in either direction strikes me as rather hardcore…
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Well, they did just open a Super 8. 😁. Friends who have worked there agree with you - that overnight tourism in Moosonee is pretty rare. It would be interesting to know whether/what percentage of s/b Polar Bear passengers carry on to Toronto or points south. Trying to align arrival/departure times between the two trains would be a challenge, particularly in the winter. The Polar Bear is a flag stop service.

If I recall, did not the recommended Northlander option call for termination in Timmins and a "shuttle" to Cochrane? The type of 'shuttle' undefined.
 
lenaitch said:
Well, they did just open a Super 8. 😁. Friends who have worked there agree with you - that overnight tourism in Moosonee is pretty rare. It would be interesting to know whether/what percentage of s/b Polar Bear passengers carry on to Toronto or points south. Trying to align arrival/departure times between the two trains would be a challenge, particularly in the winter. The Polar Bear is a flag stop service.

If I recall, did not the recommended Northlander option call for termination in Timmins and a "shuttle" to Cochrane? The type of 'shuttle' undefined.
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It looks to me like the idea is straight in to Timmins, reverse back to Cochrane and provide an “express” bus shuttle between Matheson and Cochrane…. Im not at all clear on the purpose of taking the train into Cochrane at that point though.
 
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Bureaucromancer said:
It looks to me like the idea is straight in to Timmins, reverse back to Cochrane and provide an “express” bus shuttle between Matheson and Cochrane…. Im not at all clear on the purpose of taking the train into Cochcrane at that point though.
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I’m not sure either. The only benefit of bringing the train to Cochrane would be for servicing, but the plan shows a train storage shed at Porcupine Station, likely for layovers, light servicing (cleaning and food restocking) and refuelling. There’s a spare third set for anything more involved, like routine maintenance.
 
It is not visitors to Moosonee that is the focus of the Polar Bear, but the people heading out, most with their vehicles to head south.
 
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