[Fresh Start]

And the funny thing is: of all today's fresh Ford talking points, that's the one that's been most "buried under" in this thread--even though it's perhaps most particular of all to certain UT concerns.

And Fresh Start, in particular, hasn't addressed it--maybe because it's beyond his philistine purview...

Why is it all about transit issues when it comes to Fresh Start? Is transit the only thing when it comes to Toronto?

I mean, as per Chris Hume's column on the Pugs debate linked above...

Address that, Fresh Start, address that.

Why are you singling me out, Adma? Since I likely will never be able to afford to (or frankly even want to) live along the Central Waterfront or brownstones adjacent rail corridors, what they're building there is of minimal concern to me. That doesn't mean that I'm against urbanity, but so long as a building has the standard windows and four walls I'm indifferent on one's particular aesthetics.

 

[Parkdalian]

Why are you singling me out, Adma? Since I likely will never be able to afford to (or frankly even want to) live along the Central Waterfront or brownstones adjacent rail corridors, what they're building there is of minimal concern to me. That doesn't mean that I'm against urbanity, but so long as a building has the standard windows and four walls I'm indifferent on one's particular aesthetics.

I hope you don't feel I'm singling you out. But the issue isn't just design, as Rossi pointed out. It's trying to figure out where to put the million plus people that are expected to move to the GTA in the next ten years. That is a more pressing issue than whether or not councillors get $20,000 or $50,000 for their discretionary spending. That's what pisses people off about Ford: he's always presenting people with false choices while he ignores the real, major issues and calls them worthless.

I can sympathize with anyone who wants a fiscal conservative as mayor. As Rossi pointed out at the Pug Awards, it is absolutely nuts that the city only budgets one year at a time. Sure, vote for a fiscal conservative. But I think it is crazy that anyone who posts on urbantoronto would even *consider* voting for Ford. He is clearly ignorant and proud of it.

 

[adma]

Why are you singling me out, Adma? Since I likely will never be able to afford to (or frankly even want to) live along the Central Waterfront or brownstones adjacent rail corridors, what they're building there is of minimal concern to me. That doesn't mean that I'm against urbanity, but so long as a building has the standard windows and four walls I'm indifferent on one's particular aesthetics.

And maybe, relative to Urban Toronto, that's your failing. When it comes to architecture, urbanity, et al, you're a philistine, pure and simple.

So if you feel ganged up on et al, think of it like driving the philistines from the UT temple.

And actually, I *wouldn't* be surprised if stuff like this comes back to bite Rob Ford: it may not hit home like drunken beligerence or wife beating or hillbilly-heroin weasel-dealing, but it may be more akin to the Harper Conservatives ruining their 2008 Quebec prospects by turning a tin ear to cultural matters...

 

[nfitz]

I don't even know how I got saddled as a myopic Rob Ford supporter anyway.

I think that it was as a direct result of what you posted. Particularly galling is that you claim to be pro-transit, and therefore are supporting Ford - despite no serious mayoral candidate in the history of the amalgamated city being as anti-transit as Ford.

We could go back and link to your posts, that are so naive, they just defy belief. Though no need to do that, here's one more:

Mr. Ford could not possibly do worse than what we have had, and even if he screws up, at least we'll be able to afford it.

Bizarre, just bizarre. The only reason this city would survive anyone as unqualified as Ford running the place, is that council would outvote him at every turn.

 

[Fresh Start]

Okay Fitz, can we just chalk all that up to a quick temper and a bit of a stubborn streak and just move on? No one likes to feel as though their opinion is irrelevant, so I reacted to some derisive remarks being made about me by taunting my critics with the consummate retort that Rob Ford with deal with them come October. That's all. Since people are now taking my rhetoric seriously I'll tone it down; it's not worth losing my place here at UT in defense of someone who might turn out to just be playing lip service to the plight of transit users/taxpayers after all.

 

[Glen]

That is nonsense, and you are misrepresenting the situation with the reserves. They are hardly exhausted, or even going down. Yes, getting annual financing from the emergency reserves is a problem, but it's not veering the city towards bankruptcy. Under Miller the reserves have steadily been growing. When Miller took office they were $933 billion. The most recent financial report has the reserves at $1.4 billion.

Simon, download this file and have a look at rows , 303, 493, 597 and 614. Ouch! And as if such troubling figures don't scare you, keep in mind that revenue reported in row 23 is scheduled to disappear.

 

[CDL.TO]

I won't apologize however for throwing out there the suggestion to merge routes. Routes 5 and 61 you cited there, for instance, could simply do one continuous run from the downtown to Armour Heights, and save on the number of bus drivers and timely detour to Eglinton Stn.

Well, you should apologise, because that's pretty much what the TTC does. Just because it doesn't show up on the maps doesn't mean that the TTC doesn't combine routes together when it saves money.

In the evening, the 5 Avenue is combined with the 56 Leaside and the 61 Avenue North is combined with the 51 Leslie, allowing each route to operate with half a bus/operator less than would otherise be needed. (That's right, folks. The TTC does interlining every single day on the bus network.)

And that "detour" to Eglinton station ensures are faster ride for people heading to or from locations north of Eglinton Ave (where most of the ridership is on Avenue Rd).

 

[SimonP]

Simon, download this file and have a look at rows , 303, 493, 597 and 614. Ouch! And as if such troubling figures don't scare you, keep in mind that revenue reported in row 23 is scheduled to disappear.

What is so scary there? The numbers put Toronto's debt at about $2.7 billion with unfunded liabilities of about $3.1 billion. Worst case that means the city owes about $2,400 for each person in Toronto. Compared to other levels of government, and most other cities, this is minimal. The federal government owes about $17,000 per person and the province about $15,000 per person. New York City owes about $7,000 for every person. No wonder Toronto has one of the best credit ratings of a major city in North America.

Those numbers are also only worst case. Taxpayers won't end up paying for all those unfunded liabilities. I believe that by far the largest part of the increase is about $1 billion for mortgages on new TCHC buildings (Regent Park, 60 Richmond, CityPlace etc.) These mortgages are on the books as a liability, but they will be almost completely covered by tenant rents and CMHC subsidies.

 

[nfitz]

Simon, download this file and have a look at rows , 303, 493, 597 and 614. Ouch! And as if such troubling figures don't scare you, keep in mind that revenue reported in row 23 is scheduled to disappear.

Isn't the loss of $200 million a year in revenue on Line 23, counterbalanced, by uploading about $270 million a year in welfare costs, which I assume are part of Line 76

 

[GenerationW]

In the evening, the 5 Avenue is combined with the 56 Leaside and the 61 Avenue North is combined with the 51 Leslie, allowing each route to operate with half a bus/operator less than would otherise be needed.

Who told you this, and how does that save half a driver on each route?

 

[Fresh Start]

I hope you don't feel I'm singling you out. But the issue isn't just design, as Rossi pointed out. It's trying to figure out where to put the million plus people that are expected to move to the GTA in the next ten years. That is a more pressing issue than whether or not councillors get $20,000 or $50,000 for their discretionary spending. That's what pisses people off about Ford: he's always presenting people with false choices while he ignores the real, major issues and calls them worthless.

I can sympathize with anyone who wants a fiscal conservative as mayor. As Rossi pointed out at the Pug Awards, it is absolutely nuts that the city only budgets one year at a time. Sure, vote for a fiscal conservative. But I think it is crazy that anyone who posts on urbantoronto would even *consider* voting for Ford. He is clearly ignorant and proud of it.

"If you're not liberal when you're young, you have no heart. If you're not conservative when you're older, you have no brain."
- Winston Churchill

Well thank you for at least being cordial with me. I'm just looking at the polls right now and making a strategic decision by supporting a candidate other than my sincere preference in order to prevent an undesirable outcome. If by September one of Rossi or Thomson manages to pass Smitherman in popularity, I would be delighted to pick one of them over Ford. But to me Smitherman and Pantalone are far worse alternatives to Ford. The thing with Ford why I was defending him, is that he at least informs the public on things we otherwise would not be privy to and demands accountability and budgeting restraint; which on paper might appeal to someone struggling to make sense of the City bureaucracy and all the taxes/fees we're forced to pay. I'm all for planning ahead, but people are forgeting that we're going through a recession here, unemployment rates are high -- maybe after a couple years once the economy recovers Toronto can afford to take on debts, but is now really the time for lofty visions? We may disagree on that point but I want y'all to know where I'm coming from, and respect my views, rather than insinuate that I'm an idiot for thinking conservatively.

 

[GenerationW]

I want y'all to know where I'm coming from

Hmm, well "y'all" must be a clue.......

Stone Mountain, Georgia?
Morgan's Corner, Arkansas??
Bugtussle, Tennessee???

I'm a fixin' to know!

 

[GraphicMatt]

"If you're not liberal when you're young, you have no heart. If you're not conservative when you're older, you have no brain."
- Winston Churchill

Churchill never said this: http://www.winstonchurchill.org/learn/myths/myths/quotes-falsely-attributed-to-him

 

[nfitz]

Who told you this, and how does that save half a driver on each route?

It's in the service summary - http://www3.ttc.ca/PDF/Transit_Planning/Service_Summary_2010_06_20.pdf

For example, you can see that the 5 Avenue in the evenings takes 45 minutes to do a round trip. So to meet the minimum service requirement of 30 minutes, you'd need 2 buses ... running a 22.5 minute frequency. However, rather than doing this, they run only once every 30 minutes, alternating trips with the 56 Leaside, which also takes 45 minutes for a round trip. THere are several examples of this in the schedule.

 

[cfloryan]

... Ok well I'm not sure what people have been mumbling about for the last few pages so let me just answer the original question:

Why is Rob Ford made out to be a villain on UT?

ANSWER:
- Rob Ford is a fiscal conservative while most people on UT are social progressives (Now I don't know for sure but they sure show a lot of the symptoms in these posts!).
- Rob Ford is more interested in how to manage money while most people here are interested in how to spend it
- UTers are in general younger and urban, thus favoring NDP-type policies - the polar opposite of Rob Ford's position

Also, for future Ford bashers in this thread, please read some contextual information about his past, you can start here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rob_Ford, before throwing around misinformation. You can disagree with him all you want but please do some from an informed perspective.