TTCboy13
Active Member
wow
wow
wow
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TTCboy13
Active Member
poor
poor t1s
poor t1sTTCboy13
Active Member
omg
omg is it on a truck or is it being shipped by rail
super excited last week of november
The on the TR door wasn't opened, it's externally covered with some black fabric. The front windows were also covered, except with some white material, and from the inside.
I passed by a little earlier, and the car was gone unfortunately - sorry, no new photos today (of the TR). There was however a fourth T1 car added to the line up of the ones previously posted with tarps. Does anybody know what the deal is with that one? I thought only 3 cars were damaged in the collision.
The new addition is the closest one.
omg is it on a truck or is it being shipped by rail
super excited
last week of november
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TTC12
Active Member
I hope you realize you can edit your posts and add new comments rather than making 4 consecutive posts...
Hopefully the reason the lead car is now gone is because its on its way to us
Hopefully the reason the lead car is now gone is because its on its way to us
hkric88
Active Member
omg is it on a truck or is it being shipped by rail
super excited
Ok now, I want to do a little logical analysis of this situation..
Dun get your hope up too much...
First of all it seems like, by the way you're commenting, that you are almost perceiving the new TR trains as a singular object, and as if the images posted yesterday are 'it' and that 'it' is now being shipped. So lets really keep in mind that there will be quite a few trainsets to be shipped.
We already know that one of them is in Kingston for testing (is it Kingston? can't remember but its not so relevant), the comment from (Brad Ross?) that they are expecting delivery at the end of November indicates to me that testing was successful, and completed. The fact that the one at bombardier appears to have been shipped TODAY south probably means its on the way to Kingston, I imagine they will all be run through testing there, en route to Toronto.
Something tells me that its somewhat likely, in consideration of these events, that the first TR to be delivered to Toronto could be on the rails as we speak, Though not the one you saw in the images from yesterday. That also means its not traveling as far, it shouldn't take more than a day to get here. Delivery is almost certainly going to be by rail to avoid decoupling the cars, which is much more difficult than with previous unarticulated H's and T's. This makes it certain delivery going to greenwood.
Here's the big part. This train could already be here, to be quite honest, so if anyone is near greenwood, take a peek... If its not here now, it could be delivered tomorrow, its a REAL possibility. However, lets now take into consideration that the tracks that will bring the delivery also serves and active GO train line. Due to the nature of the delivery, it will likely be pretty disruptive to that line, which normally operates at quite high speed. This would certainly impose a slow-speed order on this section, at the very least. So if there seems to be a delayed schedule on these lines, that's something to watch. However this fact could also mean delivery is forced for the weekend, probably Sunday.
The test track facility cannot handle more than one train at a time, if this new train from thunder bay has been shipped, the one currently at the test track must go somewhere, and it has only one place to go.
Like I said before.. Any day now, keep those eyes on greenwood.
TTCboy13
Active Member
cool
cool i'll probably walk near greenwood tomorrow after school...anyways is it gonna be pulled by a freight train?
cool i'll probably walk near greenwood tomorrow after school...anyways is it gonna be pulled by a freight train?
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rbt
Senior Member
Delivery is almost certainly going to be by rail to avoid decoupling the cars, which is much more difficult than with previous unarticulated H's and T's. This makes it certain delivery going to greenwood.
This makes for an amusing game.
I can't even figure out how it would be possible to ship it complete from end to end and that is without considering unloading at Greenwood.
Note, changing gauge on the receiving side no longer means it is completed at the factory
Anyway, the few hours to install articulation joints is pretty trivial compared to anything I've been able to come up with. Closest I could get is a custom carrier designed to bend exactly where the TR articulations are and installing a special "rail" ramp at Greenwood (3% grade!) to offload it from the special carrier.
nfitz
Superstar
Is there any sign that the siding from the CN tracks into Greenwood has, or could be used? When I've gone by on the GO, it always looks as though it hasn't been used in a few years.
hkric88
Active Member
I definitely do not want to suggest that the new TR cars would be hauled by a locomotive, rolling on the freight track. This would not even be done with standard gauge cars such as in NYC. This is to avoid damage and undue wear. The trucks are not designed to run in the same conditions as standard haul freight cars, esp with prolonged high speed sections and sometimes non-continuously welded rails. In every case the cars would be covered and placed on top of some kind of either specialy designed car, special individual bogies, or just a flat-bed car of some kind. However, on a second thought, the true difficulty about shipping the train set already articulated would be loading/unloading it from the delivery train...
hkric88
Active Member
They were used to deliver the T1s, and that wasn't allll that long ago.. I imagine they still ship the damaged ones via rail also, though I can't say that for sure..
nfitz
Superstar
Surely, you'd have to ship it is individual cars, and then re-assemble at Wilson or Greenwood.
I thought it was a few years ago - at least 5 or 6 years ago since the last one arrived. That's an interesting question of how they moved the damaged ones; you'd have thought they would have used those tracks. Perhaps I haven't looked closely since they left ... but by now, it might be hard to see fresh markings on the rails.
hkric88
Active Member
All of this talk is seriously making me feel like a kid on christmas eve !!!!
andomano
Active Member
Do the subway cars even have the standard knuckle coupler that heavy rail uses?
TTCboy13
Active Member
Platform 27
Active Member
A few comments deserve facepalms. I'll be polite and not name names.
I believe the test train that went to Millhaven consisted of three cars. I don't think we ever got a solid answer on whether that track was standard or TTC gauge, but regardless I can't imagine there's any reason that they'd have to wrap things up over there and move that train to Toronto before beginning to deliver subsequent trains off the line from Thunder Bay directly here. It's quite plausible the Millhaven train will keep going through various shakedown maneuvers on the test track as late as right before the first trains go into revenue service, collecting data on performance in various scenarios. At a total guess, I imagine that checking on performance in snow is on the to-do list, and Mother Nature has yet to oblige.
In terms of delivery, they'll load individual unjoined subway cars wrapped/tarped onto mainline flatbed cars, and ship them that way to Greenwood. That means there won't necessarily be any reason to send all six cars from an eventual complete subway train in a single batch. Last year, Edmonton was getting its new Siemens LRT cars shipped up in this fashion from Sacramento on Union Pacific (I think?) and some idiot railyard guy somewhere along the delivery chain ran the loaded flatcars over a yard "hump". Suffice it to say, it was established that transit cars don't much like this. There was some pretty extensive damage and they had to go right back to the factory. Interestingly, the actual handover of ownership in these cases doesn't occur until the transit stock make it safely onto the rails of their new system, so this wasn't Edmonton Transit's problem from a financial perspective.
I don't know what kind of couplers will be on these subway cars, but I highly doubt they'll be compatible with mainline trains nor contain any of the following: electromagnets, re-sealable adhesive goo, velcro, or ball-hitches. I imagine T1-compatibility was seen as a useful attribute in case a disabled train has to be towed or something.
Once the cars arrive at Greenwood, they'll get reassembled into trainsets and driven up to Wilson after-hours. Anyone who wants to set up a tent on an overpass over Allen Road and wait with a camera for the next dozen nights is welcome to take their best shot, but there's probably a bylaw against that.
I believe the test train that went to Millhaven consisted of three cars. I don't think we ever got a solid answer on whether that track was standard or TTC gauge, but regardless I can't imagine there's any reason that they'd have to wrap things up over there and move that train to Toronto before beginning to deliver subsequent trains off the line from Thunder Bay directly here. It's quite plausible the Millhaven train will keep going through various shakedown maneuvers on the test track as late as right before the first trains go into revenue service, collecting data on performance in various scenarios. At a total guess, I imagine that checking on performance in snow is on the to-do list, and Mother Nature has yet to oblige.
In terms of delivery, they'll load individual unjoined subway cars wrapped/tarped onto mainline flatbed cars, and ship them that way to Greenwood. That means there won't necessarily be any reason to send all six cars from an eventual complete subway train in a single batch. Last year, Edmonton was getting its new Siemens LRT cars shipped up in this fashion from Sacramento on Union Pacific (I think?) and some idiot railyard guy somewhere along the delivery chain ran the loaded flatcars over a yard "hump". Suffice it to say, it was established that transit cars don't much like this. There was some pretty extensive damage and they had to go right back to the factory. Interestingly, the actual handover of ownership in these cases doesn't occur until the transit stock make it safely onto the rails of their new system, so this wasn't Edmonton Transit's problem from a financial perspective.
I don't know what kind of couplers will be on these subway cars, but I highly doubt they'll be compatible with mainline trains nor contain any of the following: electromagnets, re-sealable adhesive goo, velcro, or ball-hitches. I imagine T1-compatibility was seen as a useful attribute in case a disabled train has to be towed or something.
Once the cars arrive at Greenwood, they'll get reassembled into trainsets and driven up to Wilson after-hours. Anyone who wants to set up a tent on an overpass over Allen Road and wait with a camera for the next dozen nights is welcome to take their best shot, but there's probably a bylaw against that.