[SJD_Toronto]

I just feel this project will be dead in it's tracks when Hudak gets here.

Hudak will not cancel the Crosstown. It's too far into the tunneling now and he knows that. If he cancels anything, he'll scrap the Finch West and Sheppard East LRT lines as he does want to finish the Sheppard Subway. I can see him supporting a Finch West BRT and agreeing to the Crosstown being underground all the way to Kennedy station.

Overall, Hudak has said he wants to make sure Eglinton Crosstown is mostly all underground, the Bloor-Danforth extension to Sheppard goes ahead, the DRL begins construction and the Sheppard Subway from Downsview station to Scarborough Centre station is completed.

If the polls are true, we could be on the verge of a new PC majority government. If that happens, we shall see what Hudak and his government do with GTHA transit plans.

 

[nfitz]

Hudak will not cancel the Crosstown. It's too far into the tunneling now and he knows that.

Even if they finish all the tunnelling from Keele to Brentcliffe, it's only $500 million. The main contract is for the stations and yard, which was to be awarded late this year, and that's about $4 billion.

Overall, Hudak has said he wants to make sure Eglinton Crosstown is mostly all underground, the Bloor-Danforth extension to Sheppard goes ahead, the DRL begins construction and the Sheppard Subway from Downsview station to Scarborough Centre station is completed.

The Conservatives have said this in their white paper ... but in the election campaign, they've made it clear that the DRL is the priority. Which dovetails well into their promise to cancel all the LRT lines, and only spend on subways when they get rid of the deficit, as it will surely take 2-3 years of design before DRL construction could begin.

If the polls are true, we could be on the verge of a new PC majority government. If that happens, we shall see what Hudak and his government do with GTHA transit plans.

 

[CityPlaceN1]

Hudak is only saying this to get elected. If he does it will all go on the back burner to fight the deficit. "No money" will be the mantra.

 

[MrsNesbitt]

Hudak is only saying this to get elected. If he does it will all go on the back burner to fight the deficit. "No money" will be the mantra.

One hundred percent that is what will happen with the other transit projects on the books, SELRT and FWLRT foremost. With Eglinton I can see Hudak absolutely insisting on underground only, the at-grade sections going back to the drawing board, and coming back with plans for underground-only LRT with a far higher price tag, and Hudak scoffing and saying it's too much money.

So, basically, the shredding picture is correct. Though I'd be wary about polls projecting a PC majority. I could see a PC minority, scary though that too could be, but it's within the realm of possibility also for the Liberals to pull a minority still.

 

[Eug]

Traffic at Don Mills and Eglinton isn't new.

While not new, it's often much, much worse now, which isn't a surprise because several lanes have been blocked off for the construction. This is new as of the last couple of weeks, and it sounds like it will stay that way until the end of summer.

 

[howl]

One hundred percent that is what will happen with the other transit projects on the books, SELRT and FWLRT foremost. With Eglinton I can see Hudak absolutely insisting on underground only, the at-grade sections going back to the drawing board, and coming back with plans for underground-only LRT with a far higher price tag, and Hudak scoffing and saying it's too much money.

So, basically, the shredding picture is correct. Though I'd be wary about polls projecting a PC majority. I could see a PC minority, scary though that too could be, but it's within the realm of possibility also for the Liberals to pull a minority still.

What the politicians and failing to grasp is that the most important thing with transit in Toronto is not what form it takes, or even where it is located. The MOST important thing is that something gets built as soon as possible. It takes ten to fifteen years of planning, design and construction to bring any new transit line to life. Changes to projects should only happen during the planning phase. Cancelling or changing any project once it's into its design phase not only results in major financial waste to the project, but it also has huge cost implications to community as whole as they'll have to go another decade living with gridlock.

 

[Conrad Black]

Hudak can't change it now. Too far gone.

 

[nfitz]

Hudak can't change it now. Too far gone.

How is it too far gone? Even if they complete the tunnelling (which is less than 20% done), that's only $500 million. They've yet to issue the main contract (about $4 billion) to build the stations, track, yard, etc. That $4 billion can be used elsewhere ... like providing tax cuts for the rich and corporations.

 

[Solid Snake]

How is it too far gone? Even if they complete the tunnelling (which is less than 20% done), that's only $500 million. They've yet to issue the main contract (about $4 billion) to build the stations, track, yard, etc. That $4 billion can be used elsewhere ... like providing tax cuts for the rich and corporations.

 

[nfitz]

Suggesting that Hudak would keep his promise to cancel all the LRT lines, and have the one major project for Toronto, the Downtown Relief Line, is a conspiracy?

Has it really got to the point where we consider a politician keeping his promises a conspiracy?

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

How is it too far gone? Even if they complete the tunnelling (which is less than 20% done), that's only $500 million. They've yet to issue the main contract (about $4 billion) to build the stations, track, yard, etc. That $4 billion can be used elsewhere ... like providing tax cuts for the rich and corporations.

Suggesting that Hudak would keep his promise to cancel all the LRT lines, and have the one major project for Toronto, the Downtown Relief Line, is a conspiracy?

Has it really got to the point where we consider a politician keeping his promises a conspiracy?

I agree with nfitz, something is going to happen to all of the LRT in some form soon.

 

[ehlow]

I agree with nfitz, something is going to happen to all of the LRT in some form soon.

The thing is the "cancelling all LRT" + "burying Eglinton as much as possible" quotes very much leaves open the interpretation that by making Eglinton underground, it is transformed into a "subway" rather than count as an "LRT", even if it keeps the same vehicle.

In the 2010 Ford MUO plan, Eglinton being fully buried was considered by Ford as a "subway", even though it used LRV vehicles, and he's hates LRT more than anybody. I could easily imagine something like that happening, or easily imagine the LRT being shortened to the underground part only.

Anyways this has been debated forever. In my opinion it's simply not clear, they have made some statements, but I doubt anybody knows for sure what will happen if Hudak wins.

 

[rbt]

I agree with nfitz, something is going to happen to all of the LRT in some form soon.

Note the use of specific dates for his income tax adjustment commitment and how it is immediately after the budget is balanced. Note, for his transit commitments, the lack of dates and how "after the budget is balanced" could mean the next day or the next term, or the next decade. I think nfitz is on the money with his assessment of Hudak's priorities.


"Progressive Conservative Leader Tim Hudak threw a juicy bone to Ontario voters Tuesday, promising to phase in a 10 per cent cut to personal income taxes after a Tory government balances the budget in 2016-17."

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toron...-government-would-trim-income-taxes-1.2641762


"In a technical backgrounder on the policy changes the Conservatives promise to make, the party vows “to phase in a personal income tax reduction after the budget is balanced,” in 2016 — a year before the Liberals are planning to balance the books."
...
"To that end, if elected next month, a PC government would immediately lower the general corporate tax rate to 10 per cent from the current 11.5 per cent (already among the lowest tax rates in the Canada, the Liberals point out). In 2016, when the PCs say they will bring in a balanced budget, Hudak said he would further lower the tax rate to eight per cent."

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/busine...come+taxes+2016+when+clean/9834963/story.html

Note that the immediate 11% reduction in corporate tax rates will immediately reduce revenue and reduce borrowing capabilities for the province for capital works.

Also, this second article is about Hudak's non-commitment to a system for preventing raw-sewage spills in the Ottawa river.

 

[ehlow]

What the politicians and failing to grasp is that the most important thing with transit in Toronto is not what form it takes, or even where it is located. The MOST important thing is that something gets built as soon as possible. It takes ten to fifteen years of planning, design and construction to bring any new transit line to life. Changes to projects should only happen during the planning phase. Cancelling or changing any project once it's into its design phase not only results in major financial waste to the project, but it also has huge cost implications to community as whole as they'll have to go another decade living with gridlock.

Agreed. The thing I dislike most is changing plans years after the appropriate time to do so, wasting time and money.

At the end of the the day usually something being built is the most important thing, whereas we bicker over technology details all the time.

Often when we bicker of technology choices, any of the choices would be a vast improvement over the current situation. Ex. Scarborough LRT vs subway. Either way would be much better than the SRT. BRT vs LRT, there isn't that big of a difference (at least using my interpretation of BRT which has dedicated lanes).

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

The thing is the "cancelling all LRT" + "burying Eglinton as much as possible" quotes very much leaves open the interpretation that by making Eglinton underground, it is transformed into a "subway" rather than count as an "LRT", even if it keeps the same vehicle.

In the 2010 Ford MUO plan, Eglinton being fully buried was considered by Ford as a "subway", even though it used LRV vehicles, and he's hates LRT more than anybody. I could easily imagine something like that happening, or easily imagine the LRT being shortened to the underground part only.

Anyways this has been debated forever. In my opinion it's simply not clear, they have made some statements, but I doubt anybody knows for sure what will happen if Hudak wins.

Right but we both know this is not true, its an underground lrt.