WislaHD
Superstar
I kinda want it to go to Mississauga just to stick it to Brampton some more. 
Not the mature response maybe, but neither is Brampton's city council.
Not the mature response maybe, but neither is Brampton's city council.
East Bayfront LRT would love some money too
The money should stay in Peel Region, IMO. Besides, Toronto isn't exactly the shining beacon of "we have our shit together" when it comes to their transit file
.rbt
Senior Member
The biggest misnomer in this whole thing is the "free" money aspect of it. Nothing is free.
It is free money for Brampton in the sense that it has zero impact on their cities budget.
TOareaFan
Superstar
Well we know it does not have zero impact. All that I would ask of my councilors is that they get a handle on what the impact actually is and whether they think it is worth it.
ML/MOT have said they will fund 100% of the "core capital" costs but there will be some up front cost in the form of other infrastructure and enabling works....yet no one (that I have seen) has put a number on these.....I have no idea what they are, and I don't know (and am not saying) that they are significant....but I can't believe that after all this time no one is able to even put an estimate out there for consideration.
Similarly, I have yet to see any sort of real analysis of the ongoing operating costs and what impact those may have on the city's budgets in future years.
These numbers may have a small enough impact that this is worth it for the city....but it is not free, the impact is not zero and for something that is being called "the biggest decision the city will ever make" (which might be a tad hyperbolic) it is shameful (on both sides) that these sort of things are not being discussed rather than focusing on injuctions and "we're coming after your dad" threats.
doady
Senior Member
LRT could have a huge effect on the City of Brampton budget. For example, an LRT to the downtown would allow Brampton Transit to cancel its bus service along Main St. between downtown and Shoppers World, which reduce the operating costs of Brampton Transit significantly or allow them allocate the buses to improve other routes. An LRT might also spur new development and increase property values in Brampton's downtown, both of which would increase the city's revenue.
Dan416
Senior Member
Should use the money saved by not wasting trackage in Brampton to tunnel a portion of the Mississauga route, just to piss off Brampton that much more. Screw Brampton.
Cobra
Senior Member
Tuscani01
Senior Member
Or at least tunnel under major intersections to speed up the service without affecting traffic (ie. like Don Mills on the Eglinton Crosstown). Go under Derry, Britannia, Eglinton, Burnhamthorpe, Dundas, Queensway.
ShonTron
Moderator
That's true, actually. There would be no need for routes 2 or 502 if the LRT is built; only a few stops would be affected - Frederick Street/Guest Street, Harold Street, Etobicoke Creek, Elgin Street, Charolais Boulevard/Peel Village Parkway. Nanwood Drive, the busiest bus stop between Downtown and Shoppers World, would have an LRT stop. Resources could be switched to the 52 and 8, which serve the local neighbourhoods better.
TOareaFan
Superstar
here is the kinda of "in depth" analysis that has been presented with regards to operating cost comparison that has been presented.
So the yes side are saying that in 2031 the operating costs for Brampton will be 300k lower than if the LRT was not built.
Aside from a very blatant and (potentially) significant error in this methodology.......it misses the years in between and is totally dependent on the LRT reaching its ridership projections. Where is the year by year analysis (if in reaching its ridership goals 10 years after opening it gets to such a small positive, what is the cumulative total negatives in the first 9 years.....what does that cost Brampton taxpayers)......where is the sensitivity analysis that says @90% of ridership target that +300k is X ....at 80% it is y....at 110% it is z..etc.
This is the sort of data that any councilor (pro or con) should want to know before voting.
So the yes side are saying that in 2031 the operating costs for Brampton will be 300k lower than if the LRT was not built.
Aside from a very blatant and (potentially) significant error in this methodology.......it misses the years in between and is totally dependent on the LRT reaching its ridership projections. Where is the year by year analysis (if in reaching its ridership goals 10 years after opening it gets to such a small positive, what is the cumulative total negatives in the first 9 years.....what does that cost Brampton taxpayers)......where is the sensitivity analysis that says @90% of ridership target that +300k is X ....at 80% it is y....at 110% it is z..etc.
This is the sort of data that any councilor (pro or con) should want to know before voting.
Attachments
Bojaxs
Active Member
Lol! Hold on a sec you guys! Has Brampton officially voted against the LRT yet?
TOareaFan
Superstar
There is a vote tonight...it is not on LRT or no-LRT, per se. It is on whether to accept the current proposed route. The only route that, according to ML, is on the table for discussion. Technically, no matter what happens tonight the LRT will make it to Brampton (ML has said a no vote tonight will see the HMLRT stop at Steeles which is well within Brampton).
The previous council did vote (almost unanimously) "against" it (actually voted to not accept the route and deferred final decision until other routes could be presented/considered)....but that vote was widely felt to be "unpopular mayor is voting 'yes' so we should all vote 'no' ".
DonValleyRainbow
Senior Member
I have distatste for technicalities. To make a parallel, its like saying Vaughan is getting a subway through the Spadina subway extension.
TOareaFan
Superstar
Sorry, didn't mean that as a "technicality" but some have characterized Steeles as the Brampton border and I was just correcting that. Even stopping the route at Steeles, there will be 4 stops within Brampton....but your point is well made/taken.