Everyone has a right to critic a project, even Humes. That's his job isn't it? But he should know all the facts( there are only two buildings built so far not three) about the the project before he makes a comment in his newspaper. That's his job isn't it??
 
"I was refering to buildup's reply which only commented on CityPlace. Same old same old bash CityPlace."

jDot, my apologies I did not mean to slam Cityplace. I actually like the development and its architecture and think its a great addition to the city. I was only responding to concerns raised by Hume which may not be well founded. Because Cityplace is not yet complete there may also be opportunities to further enhance it to the extent it's plan has that flexibility.
 
I assumed he was referring to most of the new towers in the area, using Pinnacle as an example. What's the huge difference between Pinnacle and Cityplace aside from the number of towers?
 
Judging from the quick sales of new units at Pinnacle centre, the buyers don't seem to care much about Humes negative comments. It seems people are buying solely on location and great amenities within the project and the surrounding area. The reselling units of the first two towers are going at about $425 to $450 per sq ft. Who wouldn't want to live by water, close to shopping, restaurants, TTC, Air Canada Centre, St. Lawrence Market...
 
Yes great amenities are standard in the Harbourfront Condos. I was amazed at the mid floor restuarants and bars in the Harbour Square Complex, I was there last weekend and it was very nice.

...and if Pinnacle has anything even close, they will rise in value, no doubt.

As for the outer apperance, the city got what it wanted, and the developer got what it wanted. And in the end , it is far better than what was there previously. ( a parking lot?)
 
Let's hope the new towers do something - anything tasteful! - to buffer the heavy green-glass'd monotony of that row of towers on Yonge Street between the rail lines and the lake.
 
buildup said:
What is to prevent Cityplace from moving down-market in 15 years? Save for the fact they are condos and not rental its hard to see. Other parts of the city have more durable qualities like high-end retail, historic architecture, proximity to commercial businesses, pedestrian friendly streets, etc. Cityplace better find some successful mixed-use model to emulate because once the trend starts to reverse it will be hard to turn-around. If most of the condos are rented out rather than owner-occupied then we're already in trouble.
At this point they should identify 5 themes to focus on and perhaps the condo owners should chip in because its their asset.

What about an office tower right smack in the middle?

A "world class" park?

A pedestrian boulevard?

This should be adresed rather than waiting for the rot to set in.
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What's to prevent high end retail or commercial businesses from moving downmarket? A park (which Cityplace will have) or a pedestrian boulevard won't do anything to keep a neighbourhood from declining. What will? At least some of the people owning their homes (check), eyes on the street (check...could be better though), and a mix of uses (not so much). Cityplace won't go downmarket for the same reason the west end of Vancouver hasn't - most of the owners live there.

I do agree that a couple locations should have been reserved for commercial or institutional buildings. An office building at the signature site would be perfect. So would a smaller one on the park west of Spadina to bring some daytime activity down there. Not gonna happen though, that's never been in the plan and the city would find it next to impossible to change that now. It will be a quiet residential middle class neighbourhood with non-destination retail at the bases of the towers. Nothing more, nothing less.

And the Jamestown comparisons are of course utterly ridiculous. They have some superficial similarities, but that's it.

edit: I'll turn your question around on you: in an affluent, growing city, what's to cause Cityplace to start moving downmarket??
 
Lack of affluence and growth? The same forces that have caused other neighbourhoods to move downmarket. City Place hasn't been granted a special dispensation by the gods.
 
Then again, St. Jamestown could go upmarket.



Speculating about the future is always fun.
 
I think the Hume article spoke mostly to how Pinnacle Centre ignores the street, in the area it is in, thereby being an isolated enclave. Not sure how that equates to St.Jamestown.... but the comparisons to CityPlace are quite weak.
I know a lot of you on this forum hate the layout of CityPlace, and feel that it is a "gated community" or that it turns it's back on the city and doesnt connect because there are no north/south streets connecting Front to Lakeshore. I have talked about this a few times before. It is virtually impossible. Say what you will about Concord just being cheap and not wanting to spend the money to link the streets, but it would never happen. Lakeshore is an expressway with a few lights, not the boulevard it tries to be. The city rightfully would not allow more stoplights connecting north/south streets and thereby slowing Lakeshore traffic. The rail lands to the north could be decked over, but there are no major streets to connect to. Connecting to Portland Street would not be worth the cost of a street bridge, and wouldnt add to "connectivity" with the north by very much. There is going to be a pedestrian bridge over that section, so at least there will be some connection, just not vehicular connections.
There is a lot of pedestrian traffic around CityPlace. Bremner Blvd see's quite a bit of foot traffic heading over to Spadina. Once Fort York Blvd connects right through to Bathurst, we will only see more and more traffic. The park, library and other community services which will be added later on doesnt exhibit an area turning it's back on the larger community.
Pinnacle Centre, however, has NO connections with the area it is in. Blame this largely on the poor aligntment of the Gardiner off-ramp. That said, I doubt Pinnacle Centre will be the blight that St.Jamestown is.
 
Jdot said:
There is a lot of pedestrian traffic around CityPlace. Bremner Blvd see's quite a bit of foot traffic heading over to Spadina. Once Fort York Blvd connects right through to Bathurst, we will only see more and more traffic.
Click to expand...

Yes, pedestrians will choose the route that's most pleasant to walk. Versus Front St., Fort York Blvd - with the supermarket enroute - will be the favoured route to/from the developments west of Bathurst.
 
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