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Once again, only 17 new streetcars are out and it is peak period. This is a recording.

14 on 510, 2 on 509 and 1 on 514.

Where are these 7 cars?
4402
4406
4408
4411
4418
4421
4422

I find it difficult to believe that there are vehicle issues to account for this entire list, as there are only two cars not in service today that were not in service two days ago (4408 and 4411). Perhaps those two cars are having some kind of issue, but what about the other 5?

Part of this would be explained by reserves - but what is the typical reserve ratio for this line? One finds it hard to believe that the reserve ratio is so high as to keep so many out of service.

This makes one wonder if TTC is deliberately not putting the streetcars they have into service.
 
pstogios said:
Once again, only 17 new streetcars are out and it is peak period. This is a recording.

14 on 510, 2 on 509 and 1 on 514.

Where are these 7 cars?
4402
4406
4408
4411
4418
4421
4422

I find it difficult to believe that there are vehicle issues to account for this entire list, as there are only two cars not in service today that were not in service two days ago (4408 and 4411). Perhaps those two cars are having some kind of issue, but what about the other 5?

Part of this would be explained by reserves - but what is the typical reserve ratio for this line? One finds it hard to believe that the reserve ratio is so high as to keep so many out of service.

This makes one wonder if TTC is deliberately not putting the streetcars they have into service.
Click to expand...
you can starch 4402 off the list as it's still in Thunder Bay. we only have numbers 4400 and then 4403 - 4426 at present for a total of 25. I like to think of it as the last number - 2 + 1 so 26 - 2 + 1 is 25. That being said they keep %15 of the fleet as spares. If you go by any of the other two yards on a regular basis you will always see streetcars just sitting in the yard. Plus with so few of the new ones they probably don't want to rack up miles on them before the others arrive to avoid having to do major overhauls on them if they don't have too.
 
not so sure. They are replacing the Bathurst car with buses in December due to a lack of streetcars.. surely if they are that short on cars they would be running as many of the new ones as possible. Its rather odd to me, they effectively haven't increased the amount of new cars running every day since June, despite recieving several new cars since then. I'm a daily 504/514 commuter, and have been looking for increases in new streetcars on the 514 for a while now.. but they keep running only 1 new one daily. I think i've seen 2 in service on the 514 once on next bus.
 
pstogios said:
I find it difficult to believe that there are vehicle issues to account for this entire list, as there are only two cars not in service today that were not in service two days ago (4408 and 4411). Perhaps those two cars are having some kind of issue, but what about the other 5?
Click to expand...
I've seen two training cars out at once on a recent afternoon - which I've never seen before, both full of trainees.

Perhaps a combination of increased training, and a couple of cars out-of-service.
 
Training 14 months after the first roll-out? And increased training at that? And two cars out of service, for what reason?

At some point one has to consider alternative explanations beyond the typical ones thrown out there. Such as, TTC is deliberately not increasing the visible numbers of streetcars out there as doing so would decrease their leverage in legal proceedings against Bombardier. If all of a sudden there is a dramatic increase in streetcars, the public will feel "hey, things are going ok, why be so hard on Bombardier?"

Just throwing something out there because the usual explanations just aren't sticking any longer.
 
pstogios said:
Training 14 months after the first roll-out? And increased training at that? And two cars out of service, for what reason?
Click to expand...
Not sure your point. The training cars are out there for all to see. I'm sure the TTC knows a lot more about training requirements than we do.

It is what it is.
 
Two cars doing training is a pretty baseline level of training for the streetcar system. We will no doubt see that many training cars out there in perpetuity. In addition to normal attrition due to retirements etc, streetcar operators have the right to bid over to bus routes, and many do, sometimes just for variety and sometimes because they relocate closer to a bus garage etc. the need to train new operators is ongoing.

I rode on a streetcar recently where the driver - a trainee - was doing her "driving exam" under the watch of an instructor. It was amusing to watch the passengers shush each other - "don't make noise, she's trying to pass her exam". Who says people in this city don't respect TTC workers?

As I have said already, we are past the point of counting cars on the street. The TTC will have metrics about availability and average km's between defect. They are much more sophisticated than we sidewalk supervisors are.

- Paul
 
As I have said already, we are past the point of counting cars on the street.

- Paul
Click to expand...
I wish you were right but if you read this thread you will see this is, unfortunately, not so.
 
Last edited:
DSC said:
As I have said already, we are past the point of counting cars on the street.

- Paul
Click to expand...
I wish you were right but if you read this thread you will see this is, unfortunately, not so.[/QUOTE]

we probably will until every route has them.

As for Bathurst is it just shortage of cars or is it some sort of scheduled work on the streets and or track?
 
adHominem said:
The TTC's notice specifically says it's because of a streetcar shortage. http://ttc.ca/Service_Advisories/Service_changes/nov511.jsp
Click to expand...
TTC has been on a streetcar shortage for years now.

With the 512 returning to full streetcar operation, the buses assigned to the 512 is moving to the 511.
Previously the 506 shuttle buses moved to the 502/503.

With the introduction of the 514, more streetcars replaced rush hour tripper buses on King resulting in more buses on other routes. The good thing now is buses now have presto.
 
DSC said:
They are not all out but are you suggesting this is some sort of TTC plot? Clearly they cannot be out 24/7.
Click to expand...

Nobody said they should be out 24/7 because streetcars don't run 24/7. As long as the reserve and training requirements are met, they should be out (we just talked about this, there are cars being held back above and beyond those requirements).
As taxpayers that paid for them, we are entitled to actually use them, not have them sit around doing nothing.
And yes, I am suggesting some kind of TTC plot, perhaps to put pressure on Bombardier.
 
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