Towered
Superstar
Convince us. I'm curious as to your view of things in this regard. I'm not saying that to be provocative.
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- Thread starter King of Kensington
- Start date
Convince us. I'm curious as to your view of things in this regard. I'm not saying that to be provocative.
Videodrome
Senior Member
Every party voted YES to those "freebies" though. How can the CPC go after Trudeau on it when they are themselves supportive of the measures that are being taken?
TheKingEast
Senior Member
Optics would have looked terrible if your party pulled the plug on the dot matrix. A lot of pain will come from all these freebies during Covid and even before it. Libs just spend spend spend. Fiscally irresponsible.
Towered
Superstar
What would your solution have been?
picard102
Senior Member
Compared to the pain without these "freebies", it will amount to zero. Fiscal responsibility doesn't equal being a miser.
Videodrome
Senior Member
Let them die?
TheKingEast
Senior Member
Are you trying to say not agreeing with every single policy change the libs made would result in people dying? It's going to be a terrible next 5+ years, just so you know. And given the spending nature of our government racking up debt during the good times, it's going to be even worse during the bad times. Headed to almost $200B dollars in debt. Explain to me how giving students $1300/month saved lives? Or CERB going to people who barely even worked? Allowing renters to not pay rent for 6 months? That 15% subsidy to employers was pretty silly too, but at least he changed it later. But why even consider that to begin with?
It's going to be a terrible next 5 years with or without the "freebies"
Videodrome
Senior Member
It is a reference to a GOP debate back in 2011, where Tea Party types cheered on a suggestion that a sick person without insurance should be left to die.
Pretty much every government will be in serious debt after this is over!
Northern Light
Superstar
If we were to discuss fiscal irresponsibility.
I would be inclined to look pre-Covid first, at regimes both Lib and Con, who slashed Corporate Taxes from a combined rate of 42% in ON to 26%
Small business got an even more aggressive give away as they used to pay at the general rate, now the posted rate is 11.5% all-in.
Meaning a minimum wage employee pays a higher sticker tax rate than does their employer.
Next we saw the give away of Capital Cost Accelerated Depreciation.
Then we can talk about the Capital Gains inclusion rate going from 75% to 50%.
That's before we even get into actual corporate welfare.
When we realize that had even 1/2 of these give-aways not been made; the Federal government would have run a surplus ever year except 2 (2008-2009) from the late 90s forward.
That, in turn would have left us (had the surplus not been otherwise allocated) with a debt less than 1/2 what it is now; which would equal more than 29B per year federally alone; and another 12B in Ontario.
Which means we would have had ample fiscal room for the types of measures seen.
****
I don't mind picking holes with some of the spending the Liberals have announced, as some of it has indeed been poorly thought out or misprioritized, in my opinion.
But lets be clear the real sin of both parties is letting the debt pile up in good times, largely by subsidizing corporations and the well off.
PS, I say this as someone who has benefited from those tax cuts; but would have been happier to see at least some of that money expended on pharamcare and dentalcare, amongst other things.........
Once we were in surplus.
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SunriseChampion
Senior Member
Both.
I got candy for the two weeks I didn't work. I chose to shut us down.
I didn't need the money, really, but I'll take it because it gives me a leg up and I pay into it......and I finally got an entitlement.
I really didn't need it. I'm able to pay my rent a month in advance through general revenue.
I'll likely pay it all back ten times over after the inevitable tax increases coming after the plague sods off so I won't have the last laugh anyway.
SunriseChampion
Senior Member
Why would everyone just die if they didn't get handouts?
Where is this idea coming from?
I got money and I didn't really need it.
Videodrome
Senior Member
Not everyone, but some in more dire circumstances might without CERB or EI.
I know we very much appreciate the CERB benefit while my wife is temporarily unemployed.
SunriseChampion
Senior Member
Why would people die?
Where are you living that people who suddenly stop working are dying in the weeks following, without government handouts?
Yeah, I appreciate the money as well as it gave me a massive financial boost, but that doesn't mean either one of us would have died without it.
Anyway, I'm working again now for the last three weeks so I'm just raking in money. You want some more handout?
Where are you living that people who suddenly stop working are dying in the weeks following, without government handouts?
Yeah, I appreciate the money as well as it gave me a massive financial boost, but that doesn't mean either one of us would have died without it.
Anyway, I'm working again now for the last three weeks so I'm just raking in money. You want some more handout?
TheKingEast
Senior Member
This is my point. A lot of people got money that didn't need or deserve it. Then you read stories like this:
Although this sees like more of a proviincial government problem, there are a lot of things going on that people don't see because they're too busy dheering.