[reaperexpress]

My post was not a critique on your excellent efforts; only a reminder to everyone about the interconnectedness of things, and the scale of required change.

No worries, I fully understood that. I simply wanted to also provide the context that although the scale of required change is large, that in itself is not a reason to be dissuaded or daunted. The mindset of transport planning practitioners has already changed in many cities including Toronto, and work is already underway to completely redesign Southern Ontario's transportation networks using a more Dutch mindset. So most of the changes are happening regardless, though they could probably happen faster if people like Not Just Bikes or @W. K. Lis realized this and supported the projects which are trying to accomplish the same things as them, rather than incorrectly claiming that everything they don't like is due to the city planners being pro-car.

What's mostly needed is some guidance and attention regarding the little design details which might otherwise get missed while implementing a totally new (to us) traffic system.

 

[crs1026]

No worries, I fully understood that. I simply wanted to also provide the context that although the scale of required change is large, that in itself is not a reason to be dissuaded or daunted. The mindset of transport planning practitioners has already changed in many cities including Toronto, and work is already underway to completely redesign Southern Ontario's transportation networks using a more Dutch mindset. So most of the changes are happening regardless, though they could probably happen faster if people like Not Just Bikes or @W. K. Lis realized this and supported the projects which are trying to accomplish the same things as them, rather than incorrectly claiming that everything they don't like is due to the city planners being pro-car.

What's mostly needed is some guidance and attention regarding the little design details which might otherwise get missed while implementing a totally new (to us) traffic system.

The “we should be like the Netherlands” faction spends a lot of time missing the point that for an allegedly anti-car culture, the Dutch are spending a huge amount of time and engineering brainpower to build a system that largely retains, rather than sheds, the automobile as a means of getting around.

They are not merely carving out more space and safety for pedestrians and cyclists……they are also trying to get it right for motorists as well. There is much we can learn…. bring on the videos!

- Paul

 

[afransen]

I think to call the Dutch anti car is to misunderstand the dynamic. They acknowledge that the car shouldn't be the default mode as that leads to unsafe and congested roads, and use nudges to encourage non-car trips. The effect that remaining car trips tend to be more effective.

 

[dullturtle06]

No worries, I fully understood that. I simply wanted to also provide the context that although the scale of required change is large, that in itself is not a reason to be dissuaded or daunted. The mindset of transport planning practitioners has already changed in many cities including Toronto, and work is already underway to completely redesign Southern Ontario's transportation networks using a more Dutch mindset. So most of the changes are happening regardless, though they could probably happen faster if people like Not Just Bikes or @W. K. Lis realized this and supported the projects which are trying to accomplish the same things as them, rather than incorrectly claiming that everything they don't like is due to the city planners being pro-car.

What's mostly needed is some guidance and attention regarding the little design details which might otherwise get missed while implementing a totally new (to us) traffic system.

I agree, like tonront's rebuilding gerrard street east in the Dutch style. But I feel like real change to happen at the Provincal level. Provincal standards need to be updated. Just how it was the design standards was for the country that pushed all the changes. Not city by city.

 

[reaperexpress]

The “we should be like the Netherlands” faction spends a lot of time missing the point that for an allegedly anti-car culture, the Dutch are spending a huge amount of time and engineering brainpower to build a system that largely retains, rather than sheds, the automobile as a means of getting around.

They are not merely carving out more space and safety for pedestrians and cyclists……they are also trying to get it right for motorists as well. There is much we can learn…. bring on the videos!

Exactly. Dutch infrastructure is not really anti-car, it's just pro-bike + transit. The Netherlands has the worlds densest freeway network, and they are constantly building highway bypasses around stuff. But the key is that road improvements are designed to improve all of the transport networks to a similar degree, to avoid shifting trips from bike/transit to car. So when they bypass a city street with a new highway, they will downgrade the traffic classification of old route, reallocating space for transit and cycling, and maybe even adding a motor traffic barrier at some point so it can only be used by local car traffic.

Unlike highway bypasses in North America, the bypasses in the Netherlands do actually reduce traffic in the built-up area and significantly improve the safety and efficiency of cycling, walking and transit.

For example, the town of Aalsmeer was bypassed a couple years ago by a new highway, so the old highway was downgraded from a 4 lane major arterial to a 2 lane minor arterial or local street (depending on the segment) with a separate 2-lane busway.

Old Highway 196 in 2016, passing through the centre of the town at grade

Same location in 2022: roadway on the left is a busway. It is now far easier and more pleasant to travel around this area by bike or by transit. It is now impossible for the bus to get stuck in traffic.

Through motor traffic gets to use the new Highway 201, which has a much higher speed limit and far fewer traffic signals than the old highway through the town.

If you looked at just the changes within the town it might appear anti-car, but when you consider the new highway bypass, you see that all modes have become safer and more efficient due to the changes.

 

[imerk]

Same location in 2022: roadway on the left is a busway. It is now far easier and more pleasant to travel around this area by bike or by transit. It is now impossible for the bus to get stuck in traffic.

It is sad to see all of those lost trees though, feels like they could have been more efficient with the available space.

 

[Jonny5]

What is this device mounted above the blue street sign?

 

[reaperexpress]

What is this device mounted above the blue street sign?

View attachment 427749

Looks to me like a radar detector. Detects cars and bicycles on the opposite side of the street.

 

[Jonny5]

Looks to me like a radar detector. Detects cars and bicycles on the opposite side of the street.

Ah. So would this replace the loop detectors in the road?

 

[Coolibop]

Usually I've seen those (larger gray box) on the side of the road pointing downward the vehicles perpendicular of the direction of travel near the stop line..

 

[reaperexpress]

Ah. So would this replace the loop detectors in the road?

If that's what it is then yes.

 

[Jonny5]

I couldn't find a better place for this: on Jarvis street, the new design has it with the middle lane double dashed yellow lane makings. Despite the overhead signals, it appears many are confusing the middle lane now as one of those bi-directional left turn only lanes. I've seen it several times in the past week.

 

[drum118]

This was sent to me and no idea where it is located. Interesting to know what the poles are made out to allow them to show the light as well cost and life cycle

 

[Monarch Butterfly]

 

[Monarch Butterfly]

The first stop signs were posted in Michigan in 1915.

A Quick Early History of Toronto’s First Traffic Signals and The ‘Right on Red’ Rule​

From link.

In the first half of the twentieth century, automobiles had quite an impact on the streets of Toronto. In 1913, there were 17,000 cars in Toronto; by 1923, the number grew to about 50,000 cars. New rules and technologies were adopted to better manage and regulate how motorists behaved, especially concerning the other users of the road and their safety.

On August 8, 1925, Torontonians were introduced to their first set of automated traffic signals. The new ‘semaphores’ were set up at the busy intersection of Yonge Street and Bloor Street on a trial basis and changed the history of Toronto’s streets forever. It was at least three years in the making, with Toronto Chief of Police Samuel J. Dickson advocating for and finally receiving the system in that time.

Before traffic lights, intersections were regulated by traffic policemen. In the 1910s, this was done largely through hand signals, whistles, and yelling. In 1920, a new ‘semaphore’ was piloted (again at Yonge and Bloor) which consisted of the officer controlling a staffed sign with the words “STOP” and “GO” written on them. The officer rotated the sign to control the flow of traffic. If one peruses archival photos of highly trafficked Toronto intersections, it is common to see a police officer amid the action.

Unfortunately, traffic signals take streetcars and buses as single vehicles. They ignore the number of passengers inside them. Toronto Transportation gives the single-occupant automobile turning left priority over the 70+ passengers on board streetcars on Spadina, St. Clair, The Queensway, and on the light rail vehicles along future light rail lines on Eglinton Avenue East and Finch Avenue West.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1590343455250993152

Maybe we should turn the streetcar and light rail right-of-way intersections into 4-way stops. The streetcars and LRVs will get better service on the right-of-way routes.