[casita]

Well, unless you count the Grenadier, which is licensed.

I'm in the Grenadier all the time. Are they licenced now?? I don't drink, so I don't pay attention. But, my understanding is that the Grenadier is dry?

I was also unaware we had official residences at the provincial level (aside from Lieutenant Governors of days past)???

Seems. to a certain extent at least, that some do exist in Canada.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Official_residence#Provincial_2

 

[the lemur]

Ford Nation?

If Doug gets in I will proclaim my neighbourhood a Ford-free micronation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frestonia

 

[kbdid]

Try reading this article for a little perspective, or perhaps talking to an actual Jewish person:

http://m.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/shouts-and-whispers/article995365/?service=mobile

Even if Ford is a blatant liar, it is an entirely plausible story. Jews were not welcome in WASPy Toronto social circles for much of the 20th century.

No one is arguing that people didn't hide their identity or that antisemitism is unfortunately alive and well, but that the over-riding factor is that the Fords appear to be full of it at every turn. The genealogists and people familiar with the region Karla Ford's grandparents immigrated from are pretty certain it's highly unlikely that they were Jewish people who converted to Orthodox. For them to whisper about persecution is insulting to people who did have to go to great lengths to hide/save their lives IMO. Sure, anything is likely, but remember this all came to light after Doug flubbed at a debate and suddenly he pulls out the "my wife is Jewish". It's about doubt in this family, not others' histories.

 

[JWBF]

And the United States elected its first black president in 2008; what's your point? Ferguson, anyone?

Sorry, guys, but while I don't believe a single word of Doug & Karla's "Jewishness", it's pretty silly to suggest that there's no reason to hide it here in Canada, especially in the first half of the last century (Christie Pits riot, etc). Of course it's far, far from pogrom-level persecution, but it still exists.

Agreed. Unfortunately what has changed is that such things have taken to the shadows. IMHO, Karla is afraid of not being excepted in her chosen "life style" friends.

 

[the lemur]

Try reading this article for a little perspective, or perhaps talking to an actual Jewish person:

http://m.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/shouts-and-whispers/article995365/?service=mobile

Even if Ford is a blatant liar, it is an entirely plausible story. Jews were not welcome in WASPy Toronto social circles for much of the 20th century.

It doesn't really seem as if the Fords have had much need for WASPy social circles only, since Rob and Doug's friends constitute a United Nations of criminal scumbags.

I don't think it's realistic to imply that Toronto has a problem with Jews in high places, if you look at the CEOs, lawyers, broadcasters, etc. The golf club is a relic. And it is highly ironic that Brian Mulroney should have defended them.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

Let's go back further to the original criticism - ie. Rob used the "k" word and that there wasn't any condemnation of such from DoFo. I found the response from DoFo and his supposedly Jewish spouse rather odd in this context. Assuming that a) she really is Jewish and b) her family has a long standing fear over being identified as such over fears of discrimination - your brother basically just insulted your wife's background, one that she has fears over due to prosecutions and all you did was demur and roll over, as if it was some everyday joke? It sounds awfully questionable to me. That's not to mention that his firm has actually lost a senior exec over this very same issue.

AoD

 

[DeathSilver]

Yeah, I cringed when I heard that, too.
Nothing wrong with choosing to stay at home, of course: you are "providing" something too then (childcare, etc) and are a full partner in the relationship. But using that word kind of negates that.

You need someone to provide the Gucci/Chanel wardrobe and the exotic Starbucks drinks when you are a stay at home mother. Sad but true. And guess what, I am sure she's fully in favour of income splitting as well. Good conservative values (expect the crack smoking gangster brother in law, hubby's hash dealing past, tooth brush stealing sister in law and convicted brother in law). But I digress.

 

[kbdid]

Let's go back further to the original criticism - ie. Rob used the "k" word and that there wasn't any condemnation of such from DoFo. I found the response from DoFo and his supposedly Jewish spouse rather odd in this context - so your brother basically just insulted your wife's background, one that she has fears over prosecutions and all you did was demur and roll over, as if it was some everyday joke? That's not to mention that his firm has actually lost a senior exec over this very same issue.

AoD

his firm lost a senior exec over antisemitism?

 

[JWBF]

Yeah, I cringed when I heard that, too.
Nothing wrong with choosing to stay at home, of course: you are "providing" something too then (childcare, etc) and are a full partner in the relationship. But using that word kind of negates that.

It brings back the fifties feeling.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

his firm lost a senior exec over antisemitism?

Mr. Rudner, who is Jewish, said he was particularly upset with Councillor Ford, his former employer at Deco, and his unwillingness to disavow that remark publicly, or any of the other slurs the mayor is alleged to have used to describe black people, Italians, gays and Pakistanis.

“He’s defending his brother, irrespective of what he does,” Mr. Rudner said. “Doug is the biggest disappointment to me.”

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...amily-firm-dealings/article18981567/?page=all

 

[kbdid]

I am a SAHM, but I get to do things like look after the kids, clean and cook - you know, house stuff. No new SUVs, shopping trips to Yorkville and I have my own coffee pot.

 

[casita]

It's about doubt in this family, not others' histories.

To add to what kbdid posted.

"should Karla Ford want to take up her so-called Judaism, the requirements would be the same as for someone with no Jewish background at all."

Rabbi Ed Elkin of the First Narayever, a traditional-egalitarian synagogue in Toronto’s Annex neighbourhood.
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/glob...ontested-as-it-is-conflicted/article21068640/

 

[lizzie]

Four systems now: English public, English Catholic, French public, French Catholic.

and the Protestant Separate School Board as well, in Penetanguishene (since the 1900's sometime). (I think there may have been a school in Mattawa - not sure when though) Penetang is French - the centre of the franco-ontario community thus predominately Catholic so.......


PS Love reading this forum and getting my daily "fix' Tks

 

[L23]

I wonder if they planned this lie ahead of time or if Doug just winged it.

Winged it, otherwise he'd have brought it up at the debate rather than afterwards when everyone had already booed him out of the place.

 

[the lemur]

Let's go back further to the original criticism - ie. Rob used the "k" word and that there wasn't any condemnation of such from DoFo. I found the response from DoFo and his supposedly Jewish spouse rather odd in this context. Assuming that a) she really is Jewish and b) her family has a long standing fear over being identified as such over fears of discrimination - your brother basically just insulted your wife's background, one that she has fears over due to prosecutions and all you did was demur and roll over, as if it was some everyday joke? It sounds awfully questionable to me. That's not to mention that his firm has actually lost a senior exec over this very same issue.

The senior exec was a guy who quit Deco because of the toxic atmosphere, right?

The thing about Doug not speaking up against Rob's use of the k-word (and other epithets accounting for about 1/3 of the alphabet, it seems) is that it didn't really bother him. He didn't see anything wrong with referring to Renata on the radio as a 'polack' either, because 'I didn't know it was offensive' basically means to him that it wasn't offensive until someone else took offence.

Rob and Doug have a screwed-up groupthink idea that they're not racist just because they have a diverse bunch of friends, and whatever names they throw around aren't racist or offensive provided they're distributed evenly and as long as everyone does it (no matter how uncomfortable anyone might be individually or privately).

These are guys whose idea of respect and equality comes down to 'be as much of an asshole to one person as you are to any other'.