Yes, it's just all the old office buildings that won't be :)

We shouldn't judge these buildings based on the amount of space that will be leased in them.

Sorry let me clarify, when I say judge I was referring to the market demand for the building and hence the justification for it to be built.

Heck I'm sure you could put up 5-10 BAs and get them all fully leased. Newer buildings have quite a few advantages over the older stock and hence companies typically like to move to them once they're complete.
 
taal said:
Yes, it's just all the old office buildings that won't be :)

We shouldn't judge these buildings based on the amount of space that will be leased in them.

Sorry let me clarify, when I say judge I was referring to the market demand for the building and hence the justification for it to be built.

Heck I'm sure you could put up 5-10 BAs and get them all fully leased. Newer buildings have quite a few advantages over the older stock and hence companies typically like to move to them once they're complete.
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If you walk around downtown you will see a huge amount of work being done on buildings that are in the previous generation of buildings....the work tends to be focused on the lobbies/entranceways, concourse levels and HVAC and elevator systems.....landlords are wary of being the guy who loses the tenants in the shuffle.

That being said, all the advantages do not rest with the new buildings (as some would think) there is a cost advantage inherent in having a mortgage on your building that has amortized 10 or 15 years and was based on a cost of construction that is also 10 or 15 years ago. The new buildings have a little less price flexibility when it comes to negotiating base rental cost.
 
Those are definitely good points. But there's only so much they can do. You're right though old older stock of buildings, particularly the higher profile ones are constantly being renovated for the better.

Regarding the lower rents I'd argue that's justified by competition new developments bring and the advantages of locating there i.e. the new buildings make it cheaper to rent in the old buildings. The other facts involved are minimal.
 
There's always a bit of creative tension going on in the downtown market place. TOareafan is certainly right in that older buildings have a built-in cost advantage. Original costs have largely been amortized. But the downtown market is actually three or four sub-markets. The "prime" tenants, particularly the large law and accounting firms, demand the prime space, in the best "A" towers. Other tenants (smaller law firms, head offices of smaller companies, government, etc.) will take somewhat older but still fairly prestigious space.

Another sub-market is the wide range of creative firms in places like the loft-offices run by Allied Properties around King and Spadina. These include advertising and media people, architects, arts people, non-profit groups, and a few of the small law and accounting firms. They wouldn't consider going into the big towers, even if they could afford it.

We need supplies of space in each of the various sub-markets, not just "the downtown office market", as tenants often won't consider crossing over between these various types of accommodation. You would never find Pricewaterhouse Coopers at King and Spadina, for example; it just doesn't fit their profile.
 
Walking by this evening, I saw that they had installed the test-glass tower. It's only two stories but the glass looks beautiful!

I took a picture but it's not worth posting.
 
wasn't the test-glass tower there for a while now. There are pictures somewhere earlier in this thread.
 
Another fourth page lurker...

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thanks for the pics, the acc is actually looking pretty stunning. i was first wrongfully skeptical when i saw that hoarding behind the glass wall.
 
So Infinity's retail is actually occupied. Last time I walked down there it was empty. Should make walking past it a little less dreary.
 
There is a Hoops bar, Subway, dry cleaner and soon to be a Panago (awesome pizza).
 
Wow... 5 years from now York & Bremner will be happenin' ... just think... massive streetwalls and heavy predestrian traffic, south of Front! Who would have thought? 9-5 traffic from the offices at 18 York & Telus, night crowds from the ACC on concert and game nights, condo dwellers in MLS, Ice and Infiniti throughout the day, with restaurants and shops to boot. Cityplace and the Yonge/Lakeshore corridor will pale in comparison.
 
I agree that cityplace will look like nothing compared to this.


However cityplace is very impressive on the skyline.
 
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