H
Hydrogen
Guest
I was making a direct comparison between the new Toronto cash fare and the existing Ottawa cash fare. Not tickets, tokens or passes. Clear?
|
|
|
- Thread starter ITcomputer
- Start date
Urban Shocker
Doyenne
Streetcar service on the routes I take most days is so dreadful I'd hoped they would've gone with the cutback option, since I'd have barely noticed any difference. The $89.75 Metroass I get through a credit union will, I suppose, now cost almost a hundred bucks.
unimaginative2
Senior Member
I know what you mean, US. Your Metropass will now be exactly $100.
299 bloor call control.
Senior Member
Again, go to Davisville Station and sign up for the Metropass Discount Plan for October. The price is right now $90 a month, and will stay that way for you for a year.
Urban Shocker
Doyenne
That requires a commitment to buy it for twelve consecutive months, I believe, which I can't make. So I buy it through a bulk purchase system for ten months a year and pay by token for the remaining few weeks that I'm in town.
299 bloor call control.
Senior Member
It does, but if you take into consideration taht if you subscribe now, you will be saving $20 a month for 12 months, that's $240, which is more than two months of metropasses at the new rate. With the two spare ones, i'm sure you can find someone to take it off your hands, not to mention the tax rebate on top of that.
Blovertis
Active Member
Over the long term, the TTC's fares have far outstripped inflation (I once saw a table that nicely illustrated this, but I forget where.)
This latest price hike sticks it to people who are most reliant on the TTC, but management has already done a good job of deterring what I might call "casual" users by jacking up the single fare to $2.75 (from $0.85 when I first moved to Toronto in 1984.) People who formerly might have been tempted to hop on the subway for a short trip now won't even think of using the TTC if they have alternative means of transportation.
The upshot is that the TTC -- particularly the subway -- seems increasingly the preserve of immigrants and the working poor. Its image seems to me less middle class than 20 or more years ago. And the more it is seen to be a service for the poor, the less outrage there will be from voters (who are disproportionately better-off) when service gets slashed or fares go up.
I fear transit in this city is locked in a downward spiral due to abysmal strategic management.
This latest price hike sticks it to people who are most reliant on the TTC, but management has already done a good job of deterring what I might call "casual" users by jacking up the single fare to $2.75 (from $0.85 when I first moved to Toronto in 1984.) People who formerly might have been tempted to hop on the subway for a short trip now won't even think of using the TTC if they have alternative means of transportation.
The upshot is that the TTC -- particularly the subway -- seems increasingly the preserve of immigrants and the working poor. Its image seems to me less middle class than 20 or more years ago. And the more it is seen to be a service for the poor, the less outrage there will be from voters (who are disproportionately better-off) when service gets slashed or fares go up.
I fear transit in this city is locked in a downward spiral due to abysmal strategic management.
unimaginative2
Senior Member
My greatest fear is that the final nail in the coffin will be Transit City. We'll spend $6 billion of the province's money on building streetcar lines all across the city, but the TTC will do such a poor job of running the routes that they will save no time over the existing bus routes. On some, travel times might increase as frequencies drop and express services are eliminated. Meanwhile, the subway is the only area where the TTC is a world leader in operations, but the city fights every plan for expansion.
The savings is only $10 a month, though. The bulk/MDP rate following the fare increase will be $100 a month.
The savings is only $10 a month, though. The bulk/MDP rate following the fare increase will be $100 a month.
Urban Shocker
Doyenne
Fear stalks the forum!
I think the Metroass was about $24, when I first bought one in 1980.
I think the Metroass was about $24, when I first bought one in 1980.
299 bloor call control.
Senior Member
No, as the MDP program states, your price is guaranteed for 12 months from the month you sign. So if you sign before the $100 a month comes into effect in November, you will be locked in to the current $91.50 rate for 12 months.
unimaginative2
Senior Member
I know, but that's still an $8.50 savings from the $100 he'd pay with his bulk buying program.
299 bloor has an idea, though. If you do get the MDP, you'd very likely to be able to find someone on the forum to buy a discounted Metropass for the two months you're away. It just depends if the hassle is worth the savings for you.
waterloowarrior
Senior Member
the cash fare didn't go up, the ticket/token price did
drum118
Superstar
Transit City does 2 things and I may change my view on this over time as it will provide a faster means to get from point A to E alone the route as well dealing with overcrowded buses. Be more reliable because it not caught up in traffic as much.
An LRT line will carry far more riders if headways does not get cut. In some places, headways would increase because the line would be over service as well not having much growth. Max headway is 5 minutes.
For each bus you cut by using LRT's, you cut the labour cost as much as 2 to three drivers depending on the route. TTC labour eats up 82% of TTC operating budget.
I have issues with the bean counters thinking that we replace the existing fleet by 80% because the new LRT's can carry far more riders. If this is done, then the headways will get longer as well you are moving riders from sardine can to another sardine can and no room for growth.
The other issue is the fact what is the carrying capacity's of the LRT in the first place and what is it based on?
We are not a one size society as well we wear large coats in the winter, carry items on our backs, in our hands, under the arm as well made be on a scooter. Then there is the strollers, bikes, etc and all these items take up room. Low floor LRT's are going to have the same problem as buses in the wheel area as it will be a pinch point and not much room for seats and standing.
If 50% of TTC service was LRT's, our fare would be a lot lower than it is today as well come November.
Both TTC and Toronto need stop thinking at the fare box ratio as it is to high and it is the only large system that has a ratio above the low 60's in the first place. Toronto is the only city in Ontario let alone Canada, not supporting transit in the first place by paying less than 20% of operation cost.
If you look at Mississauga that has less than 20% service of TTC, you would had seen them passing TTC in fare cost in 2008 when riders would see the 8th year in a row of a 10 cent fare hike if TTC did not raise their fare this year. MT has a 56% fare box recovery.
An LRT line will carry far more riders if headways does not get cut. In some places, headways would increase because the line would be over service as well not having much growth. Max headway is 5 minutes.
For each bus you cut by using LRT's, you cut the labour cost as much as 2 to three drivers depending on the route. TTC labour eats up 82% of TTC operating budget.
I have issues with the bean counters thinking that we replace the existing fleet by 80% because the new LRT's can carry far more riders. If this is done, then the headways will get longer as well you are moving riders from sardine can to another sardine can and no room for growth.
The other issue is the fact what is the carrying capacity's of the LRT in the first place and what is it based on?
We are not a one size society as well we wear large coats in the winter, carry items on our backs, in our hands, under the arm as well made be on a scooter. Then there is the strollers, bikes, etc and all these items take up room. Low floor LRT's are going to have the same problem as buses in the wheel area as it will be a pinch point and not much room for seats and standing.
If 50% of TTC service was LRT's, our fare would be a lot lower than it is today as well come November.
Both TTC and Toronto need stop thinking at the fare box ratio as it is to high and it is the only large system that has a ratio above the low 60's in the first place. Toronto is the only city in Ontario let alone Canada, not supporting transit in the first place by paying less than 20% of operation cost.
If you look at Mississauga that has less than 20% service of TTC, you would had seen them passing TTC in fare cost in 2008 when riders would see the 8th year in a row of a 10 cent fare hike if TTC did not raise their fare this year. MT has a 56% fare box recovery.
lordmandeep
Banned
IMO the TTC redeeming feature are the subways.
The frequency on the Trains is amazing compared to many other cities with better transit systems.
just to note whenever the TTC increases prices so does everyone else most of the time.
The frequency on the Trains is amazing compared to many other cities with better transit systems.
just to note whenever the TTC increases prices so does everyone else most of the time.
Chuck
Senior Member
Absolutely true. Because I choose to live in the inner city close to work, friends, and family, two or three round trips from Scarborough to downtown and back would exceed the distance that I would travel on the TTC in an entire month if it were my sole means of transportation. My metropass should not cost more than $20 a month, and if it did the TTC would actually receive more money from me than it does now. The TTC is so overpriced for short trips that I usually end up walking, cycling, or driving everywhere.