Solid Snake
Active Member
why not have both?
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- Thread starter LAz
- Start date
why not have both?
TheTigerMaster
Superstar
We don't have unlimited money.
Solid Snake
Active Member
Ever since the province went ahead with the 2B$ in revenue tools (Taxes) per years, that argument went out the windows as far as I'm concerned. Council thought the same thing, otherwise who would have thought that council would have overwhelmingly voted for Sheppard Subway, BD to Sherway Gardens, BD in Scarborough and even a Finch Subway...
Government almost never cancel taxes, so no... there is money as soon as they apply the taxes. Even the Jane LRT resurfaced with Byford saying that it would be expensive due to extensive tunneling the line would require to get to Jane Station
TheTigerMaster
Superstar
That $2 Billion/year is being applied regionally. Toronto will be lucky to see less than $1 Billion annually. And when the DRL alone cost $7 Billion, any type of Sheppard Subway extension will be scraping the bottom of the bucket for money until the next wave comes.
Adjei
Senior Member
You're assuming all that 2 billion is for Toronto, it's for the entire GTA and Hamilton. n
Solid Snake
Active Member
Regionally, we're the one sending the bulk of the money to the province. It is up to us to elect a council with guts who are relentless at defending our interests and at commanding respect from the province and the Feds, like New York and Chicago gets from their state, Paris from their region and London as well.
Councillors like Matlow and Vaughan along with Mihevc should be kick out of council with our collective foot up their butts for saying stupidities like,
"We should pay the taxes and help build the GTA while we stick to LRT (slower transit, at grade sections) while Vaughan and Richmond Hill are getting subways. Let's hand our money over for the good of the region even if the majority of the money comes from the city."
They have clearly forgot who got them elected and they behave like MPP's.
Otherwise, like Mammolitti said: " The province should upload the TTC and only then, they would have the green light to do whatever they want"
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AlvinofDiaspar
Moderator
Actually no offense, the province always had the green light to do whatever they want. Perhaps you should recall what Tim's Hudak idea of uploading just subways to Metrolinx was all about (if the whole megacity episode of 97 haven't convinced you the surpremacy of provincial authority, that is). As to the matter of guts, well, good old Scarborough help to give us a mayor who think he can get subways without paying anything or putting forward an actual plan other than pulling provincial money from one pot to another, so really what "guts" are we talking about?
AoD
AoD
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CapitalSeven
Senior Member
Not entirely. Part of the howling is to replace the RT line with a subway costing 500 million (or actually a billion) more, which is messing with the first wave, and muddying the waters to the extent that you can't tell the waves apart. Then all sorts of me-too propositions that make no economic sense, like Sheppard West and Sherway get dragged in. Then, because there's a chicken for every pot, but not enough gas to cook any of them properly, they more or less all don't happen. This is what happened in the 90s.
Long-time readers of this space will recall a frequent contributor (and really a rather well informed one) who seriously argued that Toronto ought to have made all the Transit City lines subway, since the Province came along and funded everything a bit later, and so would have built Toronto 7 long subway lines for nothing. And we all saw how that worked out, circa 2009.
denfromoakvillemilton
Senior Member
-Alvin.
I want a full sheppard subway imo. More ridership. Go west to Jane/Sheppard or Rexdale Blvd and in the east all the morningside. Part of the reason so many people are against the current subway proposal is because ending at STC does nothing really, when creating a transfer of two subways(assuming BD extention to sheppard or steeles) would help the flow of traffic better. Plus take pressure off of the current Rapid transit system.
I want a full sheppard subway imo. More ridership. Go west to Jane/Sheppard or Rexdale Blvd and in the east all the morningside. Part of the reason so many people are against the current subway proposal is because ending at STC does nothing really, when creating a transfer of two subways(assuming BD extention to sheppard or steeles) would help the flow of traffic better. Plus take pressure off of the current Rapid transit system.
GenerationW
Senior Member
Not even the most ardent Sheppard subway advocate is proposing an extension to Morningside. What a massive waste of money that would be.
Evening
New Member
If the Sheppard East LRT goes ahead as planned, would it make sense to re do the remaing parts of the Sheppard subway into LRT and then extend that LRT west to Downsview? Im sure this sounds ridiculous but I think I would prefer a seamless rapid transit link from the Spadina line to the Yonge line and eastwards rather than have three separate lines even if part of it is a full subway.
GenerationW
Senior Member
It's been discussed, but I think converting from subway to LRT (seen as downgrading to many) and paying $500+ million to do it will never fly politically.
TheTigerMaster
Superstar
Yes it would. It's been discussed quite a few times here on UT. TTC says that conversion to LRT would cost us $500 Million. Great project for the future, but we have other priorities for now.
And welcome to UT!
Evening
New Member
That was my fear. It seems like the only logical move after going ahead with LRT but Im sure there are alot of people who will only see that the subway is being replaced with LRT and be up in arms.
Yes it would. It's been discussed quite a few times here on UT. TTC says that conversion to LRT would cost us $500 Million. Great project for the future, but we have other priorities for now.
And welcome to UT!
Lol, thanks TheTigerMaster
Im glad that this isnt just a crazy thought in the back of my head. Hopefully in the future people realize the value a project like this could have.
Edward
Senior Member
Extending the Sheppard line west to Downsview/Sheppard West is important I think. A more connected system is valuable.